235 replies to this topic

[mssmison]

I'm also with Ben,

 Dozer and others have volunteered a lot of personal time into the development of this table and the many others posted here, I think your comments go a little too far this time.

 

Please continue to contribute your thoughts ideas and mods, but also please be respectful of the time that others have put into this already.  

Edited by mssmison, 18 February 2016 - 02:21 AM.

[Dozer316]

My 10 year old daughter loves this table too but what really set her off like she'd had a gallon of red cordial was the alternative trough sound, the alternative physics that feel like a ball in mud and especially the 120 db ball rolling sounds.  

[robertms]

...especially the 120 db ball rolling sounds.

Lol, the funny thing is you actually can't hear ANY ball rolling sound in that video...

[ClarkKent]

 

...especially the 120 db ball rolling sounds.

Lol, the funny thing is you actually can't hear ANY ball rolling sound in that video...

 

 

Yeah, because there is none in the mod. A ball in a pinball machine makes absolutely no rolling sound because some kind of exotic physics prevent noise coming from there...

 

I wonder if people moaning about the new physics ever played a real MM or any other machine from that time.

If it's not allowed to speak out severe problems with a table then I won't do it anymore. Nevertheless the inaccuracies are causing the troubles. VP9 physics was very forgiving so it was not necessary to make it extremely exact. But VP10 physics is THAT good that if you are not doing things exact you will always get different results than in reality.

 

Do you know that original table designers at Williams back in the 90s moved objects on the table by just 1/32 " just to get a better flow or prevent balls from draining? They had to be very exact - even on real tables. They knew that this could make a big difference.

 

I just made some small changes just to show that the devil's in the detail:

https://www.dropbox....4v/pic.jpg?dl=0

Edited by ClarkKent, 18 February 2016 - 07:22 AM.

[DonRobby]

I also must say it's important to show the respect for the efforts to make this conversion.

Without Dozer's efforts we wouldn t even have this cool game.

And the fact that he gave soo much effort to clean up soo many things to make it as perfect as possible is something worthy to bow down to.

I however also agree on Clark's perspective.

A thing with the pop bumpers is causing the ball to pass without a single hit when it falls into the right lane.

The pop bumpers on this game definitly are a issue.

This game is designed to stack a lot of bonus multipliers up to 99x.

This will not be possible right now and we miss out on a lot of important points.

A bad shot at the damsel ramp results in a drain, but on the real machine it's more the other way around, peasant shots rolling back are lethal.

Peasant s ramp design is more easy to shoot at wich reduces the risk of taking a shot.

Damsel however is the harder ramp to shoot at and with a position like this that becomes a great risk.

To me it feels that the ramp is placed too far to the right and a little too much to the front.

The new pictures Clark shows here have marks from the ramps and walls in sight and are the perfect thing to study.

 

But if Dozer states he will not use any of our suggestions then maybe we should open a new topic and make it an official mod so we don t invade on his turf.

That would be the last thing that I want to do.

The only thing I would still recomend is trying to find the balance in tuning walls, ramps and rubbers.

Some of these settings are found in that recommended physics topic and have a range value so you can try everything in between as well

Everybody has a different vision and that will always be the case but I value the effort nevertheless.

Have played Dozer's game for many hours and even beat the game and that kinda says how much I love it

[STAT]

Once, i had a Lock-Ball, but Ball rolls through Main-Gate ... i think, this should be impossible ?

 mm_castle.JPG   116.95KB   16 downloads

Edited by STAT, 18 February 2016 - 11:40 AM.

[mssmison]

I just wanted to share that I've found a solution that works for me regarding FPS. I have a GTX 260 and normally for this table I've had to disable reflections on the playfield as well as turning down the detail quite a bit. 

 In playing around tonight I found that if I enable static rendering for the castle (on layer 7) I gain about 10 fps even after turning back up the detail level to full which means I can lock in at 60fps now.

 Results may vary I suppose but hopefully this helps someone else.

 

Cheers

[ClarkKent]

I've completely revised the bumper area with correct objects and correct positions. It's better than before but still not fully functional. That's because the playfield is slightly distorted. So I remade the playfield from my scans, I think a full VPX rebuild will be the only solution to get correct game play.

 

https://www.dropbox....yfield.png?dl=0

 

I spoke with JP in the mean time and cleared things up why the mess on the playfield - the playfield pictures was replaced at some point and the objects were not repositioned. That's an additional reason for the weird ball behavior at some areas.

 

The latest revision can be downloaded with the link already provided.

Edited by ClarkKent, 20 February 2016 - 07:25 PM.

[vampirolatino2]

thanks, downloadingggg

[ClarkKent]

By the way - as you can see here on the actual picture I made of a MMR last week, the castle is not shiny at all...

 

https://www.dropbox....Castle.JPG?dl=0

[dark]

By the way - as you can see here on the actual picture I made of a MMR last week, the castle is not shiny at all...

 

https://www.dropbox....Castle.JPG?dl=0

This struck me as not realistic either, I can see the appeal of adding 'shine' to the material especially when everyone is still experimenting with the huge variety of 'looks' you can get from materials.

 

In regards to the photoshop'ed shadows, I think they look great with the exception of the wire ramp shadow that goes over upper center playfield, in reality if a shadow was present it would either be much smaller (showing a sharp, dark cast shadow) or diffused (spread out but almost invisible).  I know the idea is probably to make the wire 'reflection' on the playfield more visible, but it's the one thing that throws me off visually on the table.  Other than that I'd say it's a visual VPX master piece really.

 

I've always been a big fan of Dozer's approach to lighting tables.  Even back in VP9 when we only had 'fake' lighting, he consistently made efforts to 'simulate' more realistic lighting.  I drew inspiration from his work when I did the lighting on Last Action Hero and Jurassic Park.  For those contributions I can't thank him enough.

[Umpa]

I As I have said before thank you dozer great table. I must say great job to Clark as well I just finished playing your physics changes and I love it. Thanks!

[Ben Logan]

What an amazing table. Love both versions: Dozer original and Clark mod. Thanks, guys.

[ninuzzu]

Agree, btw, to fix some graphical issues:

 

- in layer4 select the prim_bolts and change size to 1,1,1

- in layer7 select Primitive1 (these are the electrical wires) and change size to 1,1,1

- in layer8 select the ramps and change position to 0,0,0 and size 1,1,1

 

I talked with Dozer and he said he changed the size to accommodate the changes to the right ramp

[STAT]

Thanks to all - wheres the final ?

[Dozer316]

Thanks to all - wheres the final ?

 

Waiting for your Merlin 3D model