9 replies to this topic

[whynotpizza]

I have real 3 Chimes and also have real solenoids in a 10 Bumper config.

 

When DOF uses Chimes does it disable the "Bumper" and fire the chime?

 

If so is there a mapping (Chime 1 = 10 Bumper Back Left for example)

 

10 Bumper Back Left

10 Bumper Back Center

10 Bumper Back Right

10 Bumper Middle Left

10 Bumper Middle Center

10 Bumper Middle Right

Slingshot Left

Slingshot Right

Flipper Left

Flipper Right

---

Chime 1

Chime 2

Chime 3

Chime 4

Chime 5

 

[Outhere]

I have real 3 Chimes and also have real solenoids in a 10 Bumper config.

 

When DOF uses Chimes does it disable the "Bumper" and fire the chime?

 

If so is there a mapping (Chime 1 = 10 Bumper Back Left for example)

 

10 Bumper Back Left

10 Bumper Back Center

10 Bumper Back Right

10 Bumper Middle Left

10 Bumper Middle Center

10 Bumper Middle Right

Slingshot Left

Slingshot Right

Flipper Left

Flipper Right

---

Chime 1

Chime 2

Chime 3

Chime 4

Chime 5

 

When DOF uses Chimes does it disable the "Bumper" and fire the chime? -No

[whynotpizza]

Ok makes sense.
 
What happens if I want to use "real" Pinball Pop Bumpers? Do I have to stop using bumpers I have set to solenoids and replace with these pop bumpers?
 
What should I set the 3 of them to in DOF?
 
10 Bumper Middle Left
10 Bumper Middle Center
10 Bumper Middle Right

Edited by whynotpizza, 11 September 2022 - 02:54 AM.

[wiesshund]

Ok makes sense.
 
What happens if I want to use "real" Pinball Pop Bumpers? Do I have to stop using bumpers I have set to solenoids and replace with these pop bumpers?
 
What should I set the 3 of them to in DOF?
 
10 Bumper Middle Left
10 Bumper Middle Center
10 Bumper Middle Right

 

Set them wherever you want them.
Though i would pick something that is a logical table location

 

Here is a DOF event list
The event numbers are arbitrary, they dont mean anything unless it is a table config

but it shows you a toys list (minus things like addressable LEDs

 

'E101 Left flipper
'E102 Right flipper
'E103 Slingshot left
'E104 Slingshot right
'E105 Bumper back left
'E106 Bumper back center
'E107 Bumper back right
'E108 Bumper Middle Left  -- Left DropTarget Hit
'E109 Bumper Middle Center -- CenterDrop Target Hit
'E110 Bumper Middle Right -- Top DropTarget Reset
'E111 Knocker
'E112 Shaker
'E113 Ballrelease 
'E114 Red flashers
'E115 Green flashers
'E116 Blue flashers
'E117 Beacons
'E118 Fan
'E119 Strobes
'E121 Right Kicker - Above Lower Right Slingshot
'E120 Red undercab
'E122 Green undercab
'E123 Blue undercab
'E124 Left Target Reset
'E125 Center Target Reset
'E126 Top Target Reset
'E127 Top Slingshot left
'E128 Top Slingshot right
'E129  chime 1
'E130  chime 2
'E131  chime 3
'E130 Hell ball motor
'E133 Hell ball Green 
'E134 Hell ball Red 
'E135 Hell ball Blue
'E136 Gear Motor

for any toy that you do not have
Lets say you only have 3 pop bumper solenoids
in your DOFConfig, you may have to combine top middle and lower  left, right and middle pop bumpers for example

 

If you dont already have 9 bumper solenoids, go ahead and add 3 pop bumpers

and assign them

 

DOF fires off whatever you have told your DOFConfig that you have.

I do not have DOF but it works like this

 

config
top left bumper  ch1

top center bumper ch2

top right bumper ch3

middle left bumper ch4

middle center bumper ch5

middle right bumper ch6

(now assume i do not have any more bumpers)

lower left bumper ch4 (we are sharing)

lower center bumper ch5

lower right bumper ch6

 

so i will use 3 of my solenoids for both middle and lower bumpers

 

If you have 9 bumper solenoids then 

 

lower left bumper ch7 

lower center bumper ch8

lower right bumper ch9

 

CH being the channel on your DOF controller

 

The table configs simply link an event to a toy

event 105 = back left bumper

which fires off whatever you have set as back left bumper
 

You can crap in as many toys as you have DOF channels
and i think you can run multiple DOF boards and have a 15 note set of chimes if you want
though you would probably have to do both some customizing of your table config, and some table script editing to accommodate some really big crazy stuff like that
But, it is entirely doable, you can make DOF do whatever you want

[whynotpizza]

Thanks for the info. Agreed DOF has many configuration options here

Let me ask the question a little differently.

Im really interested in switching pop bumpers into my mix. I currently have little tiny solenoids that work OK, but the pipe bumpers really zap. So what I want to do is change out a handful of the solenoids for real pop bumpers. Im just trying to figure out which specific existing DOF setting I should change to maximize my affect. I am trying to minimize the amount of script changes, really dont wanna make any, and just wanna switch out a handful of pop bumpers for the appropriate DOF.

Seems to me a lot of pinball machines have three pop bumpers on them. Yet in the DOF config I dont see a specific popped bumper selection. So if I were to have a 10 pop bumper configuration, two flippers, two slingshots, and six pop bumpers, which of the six should I trade for real pop bumpers? Or do I just do them all?

Edited by whynotpizza, 11 September 2022 - 08:28 PM.

[wiesshund]

Thanks for the info. Agreed DOLF has many configuration options here

Let me ask the question a little differently.

I’m really interested in switching pop bumpers into my mix. I currently have little tiny solenoids that work OK, but the pipe bumpers really zap. So what I want to do is change out a handful of the solenoids for real pop bumpers. I’m just trying to figure out which specific existing DOF setting I should change to maximize my affect. I am trying to minimize the amount of script changes, really don’t wanna make any, and just wanna switch out a handful of pop bumpers for the appropriate DOF.

Seems to me a lot of pinball machines have three pop bumpers on them. Yet in the DOF config I don’t see a specific popped bumper selection. So if I were to have a 10 pop bumper configuration, two flippers, two slingshots, and six pop bumpers, which of the six should I trade for real pop bumpers? Or do I just do them all?

 

DOFconfig most certainly does have pop bumpers
It recognizes 9 pop bumpers
I dont think any table ever made has 10 pop bumpers?

 

flippers and slingshots are not pop bumpers

 

You trade your existing pop bumpers for pop bumpers, not really sure what you are asking?

why would you trade flippers and slingshot solenoids for pop bumpers, it would sound and feel hideous 

 

[whynotpizza]

My current setup is 10 solenoids at the moment

I am switching 2 x slingshots and 2 x flippers for 4 x real flippers running at 12VDC

Id like to trade out some (maybe 3) of the remaining 10 Bumper for real pop bumpers and am not sure which ones I should switch in DOF

Edited by whynotpizza, 12 September 2022 - 12:42 AM.

[wiesshund]

My current setup is 10 solenoids at the moment

I am switching 2 x slingshots and 2 x flippers for 4 x real flippers running at 12VDC

Id like to trade out some (maybe 3) of the remaining 10 Bumper for real pop bumpers and am not sure which ones I should switch in DOF

if you run real flippers on 12VDC, you may not like the result
12VDC is very low for those, i am not sure what kind you have but they can use upwards of 50VDC
they may work pretty wimpy at 12VDC

if you really want flippers to sound like flippers
12VDC contactors would be the way to go

Or you could use push/pulls, with a bell crank whacking a piece of metal into a chunk of plastic
of course, you are nearly building a flipper then but you could get the sound exact.

Contactors do no care how long they are energized for, they are designed for continuous duty
So with those you can hold the flippers down all day, they dont burn up

 

Even a real flipper solenoid cant do that.

 

As far as which 3 pop bumpers to use the real ones on out of the 9, not 10, bumpers you have?
I would guess that top bumpers are the most prevalent, but maybe that is o nly on the tables that i play.

 

Personally, i guess i would redo my DOF config for having only 3 bumper solenoids
It would be sort of less frequent to be hitting upper middle and lower bumpers at the same time (can happen of course in multiball)

And adjust your configs accordingly.
That way i dont go from a pop bumper going THWACK! to one going cliink clink

Dont know how well pop bumpers run on 12VDC though?

 

then i would shift the other 6 solenoids that were bumpers to another job
target bank resets
Kickers etc.

 

Slingshots, i'd probably use some pushers but i would have to experiment with impact materials
to see what mimics the sound closely

[whynotpizza]

I did quite an extensive set a tests using various coils, and found a good combination that work well at 12vdc - They sound exceptionally better than any of the other things I have tried including Siemens contactors truck solenoids regular solenoids. The noise and vibration from these at 12 V is amazing. And the initial draw on the flipper is only about an amp.

[whynotpizza]

Here is what I am going with based on testing all kinds of coils.

 

Ideal Real Pinball Flipper Coil: (2 x flippers + 2 x slingshots)

  FL-11753 (Parallel Winding)

  LINK: https://www.thepinba...3-flipper-coil/

  Initial Resistance = 9.9 ohms

  Initial Current (measured max) = 0.917 amps at 12 VDC

  Activated Resistance = 157.9 ohms

  Activated Current (measured max) = 0.075 amps at 12 VDC

 

Ideal Pinball Pop Bumper Coil: (either 3 x for pop-bumpers or 6 x - need to figure out where to put them)

  AE-26-1200 (Serial Winding)

  LINK:  https://www.thepinba...=product&id=241

  Resistance = 10.8 ohms

  Current (measured max) = 1.089 amps at 12 VDC

 

NOTE(s):

1. Ideally would like to get the current down a bit more on the Pop Bumper, so may try one more coil (AO-27-1300 at 14.5 ohms) to see how it performs.

2. In order to kick the pop bumper at 12 VDC, I had to physically cut the spring in half to allow the spring to be softer (less resistance) so it still would consistently move at 12 VDC

3. Remember there is no physical BALL being pushed by the Flipper or Pop Bumper, so really this is all about striking the right balance of "noise" and "vibration" which is clearly very good, much better than anything else I previously tried in my opinion (Siemens contactors, Truck Solenoids, China Solenoids, etc.)

Edited by whynotpizza, 13 September 2022 - 01:20 AM.