68 replies to this topic

[parabolic]

Hey guys,

Well I finally managed to get my 46/32/17 cabinet built and working with pinballx and 50 tables (to start) in Vpin. Im now in the phase where I have to take it all back apart to do the paint and finish work. With that being said, I have not done ANYTHING with ledwiz before, and wondering if its really an advantage and if so is there a guide somewhere on setting it up? Im running the Freescale mod for the nudge and plunger - and I know theres SOME LEDWIZ support incorporated into that as well.

I looked on youtube and didnt find any instructional vids on it - mostly completed cabs.

 

Thanks for any help! 

 

[arngrim]

SOME ledwiz support? something like 400 tables , and ask anyone who has force feedback, it is not possible to go back one you have tasted

[gtxjoe]

Good overview of the hardware setup

http://www.vpforums....showtopic=13768

[mjr]

I have not done ANYTHING with ledwiz before, and wondering if its really an advantage and if so is there a guide somewhere on setting it up? Im running the Freescale mod for the nudge and plunger - and I know theres SOME LEDWIZ support incorporated into that as well.

 

First, as to whether you want an LedWiz in the system.  If the question is whether or not you want feedback toys in your system, the answer is YES!  They make all the difference in the world.  If you're going to the trouble of building a cabinet, it shouldn't just be a glorified video game when you're done.  Physical feedback elevates the experience to something you can't approach with VP on the desktop.  If the question is whether the LedWiz is the only way to do this, the answer is no - you could use Sainsmart relay boards for everything, for example.  You can also use the Freescale for about 20 outputs if you build the booster circuit I have in the Pinscape guide.  But I think an LedWiz is the easiest and cheapest way to get a big bunch of outputs - 32 outputs for about $50.

 

I totally understand your frustration piecing the how-to information together.  The LedWiz itself is really light on documentation.  The knowledge you're after is on this forum, but it's very scattered around.  There is one good tutorial: Pinball Electrical 101.  If you haven't seen that, it's worth checking out.  It has pretty light coverage for the LedWiz setup, and it'll probably seem a little dated at this point, but I think it'll help.

 

I think the main reason it's hard to find details is that the basics are pretty straightforward; everyone assumes everyone knows them.  The LedWiz is a USB plug-and-play device, so there's almost nothing to do on the computer side to set it up, especially if you use DirectOutput Framework.  On the hardware side, the LedWiz has 32 screw terminals for its output ports.  The output ports are designed so that you wire the "+" voltage directly from your PC power supply to one terminal on the device, and wire the other terminal on the device to the LedWiz output port.  Say you're hooking up a flasher LED:

 

   LED "+" terminal  ----> resistor ---->  +5V

   LED "-" terminal ----> LedWiz output port

 

There's some confusing verbiage in the LedWiz install guide about output bank voltage levels and USB power limits.  My advice is to basically ignore that and just connect the "+" side of each device to the appropriate voltage from your PC power supply.  (I actually use two PC power supplies - one for the PC itself, another for the feedback devices.  This is just to make sure the PC is never browned out by coil inrush surges.  Probably overkill.)  If you do that, and use diodes on everything with a coil (which we'll come to in a moment), you can ignore the LedWiz banks entirely.

 

If you're hooking up anything with a coil - a relay, contactor, motor, solenoid, etc - you have to put a diode (1N4007 works for almost anything) across the terminals of the device, with the negative side (the stripe) on the LED on the "+" terminal.  Coils release stored-up magnetic field energy as an electric pulse when they're powered off, in a reverse direction from the external current that was applied when powered.  The diode shunts the pulse back through the coil windings to dissipate as heat so that the electrical energy doesn't surge through the rest of your circuitry (it can cause damage as well as electrical interference that falsely triggers logic circuits).

 

   Coil  terminal 1 ---->  +24V

           |

        1N4007 (stripe toward terminal 1)

           |

    Coil terminal 2 ----> LedWiz

 

The other thing you have to know about coils and motors is that you mostly shouldn't hook them up directly to the LedWiz.  The LW output ports are only rated for 500 mA per output, and you can't even count on that much, because they have a separate wattage limit for each bank of 8 outputs.  Running all ports at full blast at the same time can overheat the output driver chip and damage or destroy it.  The name really does tell you how it was meant to be used.  Lots of people seem to get away with hooking up the Siemens 24V contactors directly, but you definitely can't directly attach a shaker motor (~2A typical sustained, 3A inrush), knocker coil (3A sustained, 4A inrush), or anything like that, and I wouldn't even attach contactors directly.

The ideal solution for coil loads, as far as I'm concerned, is Zeb's booster board.  It's an amazingly clever little board that has a piggy-back arrangement for your LedWiz.  You just pop your LedWiz on top of Zeb's booster (best to solder it in place), and all 32 outputs are magically boosted to 5A each.  That's big enough for practically anything you want to attach.  The only downside with Zeb's board is that it's not cheap - about $100 US on top of the $50 for the LedWiz.  Totally worth it to me for the simplicity and solid engineering, and if you price out the components, it's even a decent deal vs DIY.  But you could save some money at the expense of more complexity by going with a mix of LedWiz and Sainsmart boards - use the LedWiz to control your lights, use the relay boards to control your inductive loads.

[parabolic]

SOME ledwiz support? something like 400 tables , and ask anyone who has force feedback, it is not possible to go back one you have tasted

Ok...being new to this can you please explain how it works? I understand the motors and relays to simulate the force feedback, but what about the LEDs? are they scripted to just the bumpers and kickers? do they really make the simulation more immersive? 

[mjr]

Ok...being new to this can you please explain how it works? I understand the motors and relays to simulate the force feedback, but what about the LEDs? are they scripted to just the bumpers and kickers? do they really make the simulation more immersive? 

 

For 1980s-and-later tables, the flasher LEDs are usually controlled by the original table ROMs.  It was typical in games from the 80s on to have about 5 big, bright flasher bulbs located around the playfield.  So with flasher LEDs, you get the authentic light show that the real machine was designed to put on with its own flasher bubs.  The RGB LEDs let the table config route things to the correct color element so that you get the same color effects as the original.

do they really make the simulation more immersive? 

 

I think so!  Very much so. They're such a better effect than the simulated glare/bloom effects that a lot of tables use on-screen - really makes the on-screen bloom look fake.  At some point I'm going to go through my tables and turn down the glare effect on the more aggressive tables since it's so unnecessary when you have real flashers.

Edited by mjr, 04 October 2014 - 07:43 PM.

[parabolic]

Thanks MJR!! I should have known youd go pretty in depth with the details on this!! I thought of trying the outputs on the freescale - since that wont cost me anything, however, will it make a diffrence of which lights flash if the address on the board is diffrent (IE - 8 instead of 1)? Also is there anything I have to change scriptwise on the tables?

[mjr]

Thanks MJR!! I should have known youd go pretty in depth with the details on this!! I thought of trying the outputs on the freescale - since that wont cost me anything, however, will it make a diffrence of which lights flash if the address on the board is diffrent (IE - 8 instead of 1)? Also is there anything I have to change scriptwise on the tables?

 

The unit number won't affect any table scripts.  You only have to set it once, in the DOF configuration.  If you're *only* using the Freescale board (no actual LedWiz), though, you could instead just change its unit number to 1 via the config tool - then you wouldn't even have to set the DOF config because it defaults to unit #1.  The reason I have it use #8 in the Freescale software is that I didn't want it to conflict with anyone's real LedWiz, and I figured no one could possibly have 8 or more of them!

[parabolic]

Cool! so once its changed how do I know what channel does what? Thats what im in the dark on this mostly....lets say channel 1 is supposed to be a bumper - how do I know that? And is it common across most tables?

[arngrim]

dof and configtool can support 16 ledwiz

what is freescale board?

mjr, i just thought of another solution for your ledwiz 8, configure 8 ledwiz on your account, fill the the 8th only, or the ones that needs to match your ledwiz #, and at the generation of the ini, i only generate ini for controllers that have at least one toy mapped

[Scorp.ius]

Here is a video about LED-Wiz installation.

Project V-Pin #04: LED-Wiz (english subs):

[parabolic]

what is freescale board?
 

http://www.vpforums....showtopic=28313

Only the most affordable and AWESOME analog plunger/Nudge/ IO system made by MJR himself!!

Here is a video about LED-Wiz installation.

Project V-Pin #04: LED-Wiz (english subs):

YEAH....I saw that.... dont speak german and HATE subs!! LOL!

[gamefixer]

I'll say this about the LEDWiz and LED's (I dont have any solenoids hooked up yet so I cant speak on them). The first time I got the LED bar working in my cab I had the biggest S*** eating grin on my face. WHOLE NEW DIMENSION to the games simply from some flashing lights. Seriously, do it. You wont regret it.

[zebulon]

I haven't been posting much lately, but maybe I can chime in here to help explain things.

 

Let's go back to the basics and work from there.

 

What is a LEDWiz?

 

The Ledwiz is a clever device designed and marketed by GroovyGamegear. The purpose of a LEDwiz is to provide a usb interface to control output devices. Practically anything can be controlled by it (leds, coils, car starter, thermo nuclear warheads) with the proper supporting hardware (transistors, relays, direct connection, etc).

 

The limitations of the ledwiz boil down to the output load that it can support......500ma per channel (output) to a maximum of 2w per driver (individual chip). In real world terms that means that if you want to drive a coil that draws 3A@12v you are FUBAR'd unless you somehow boost the output capacity with an external circuit (relay, transistor, etc).

 

An example of calculating the power handling of the bare ledwiz would be....

 

2 leds that draw 20ma each at 12v (unreasonably high for the average led but this is just an example after all)

 

total draw would be 2 x 20ma = 40ma

 

total power would be 2 x 20ma/1000 x 12v =  .48w

 

(you divide by 1000 since 1ma is 1/1000th of an amp)

 

The above scenario is perfectly acceptable for the output of the ledwiz. The total draw is far less than 500ma and the total power requirement from the ic is far less than 2w.

 

Now 2 350ma @12v leds....

 

total draw would be 2 x 350ma = 700ma

 

total power would be 2x350/1000 x 12 = 8.4w

 

Obviously, we have exceeded both the individual output rating and the overall power rating for the driver ic and have likely released the magic smoke from the circuit rendering it useless....

 

How to connect the ledwiz?

 

The ledwiz sinks the current in a circuit. What that translates to is that it closes the circuit on the negative side.

 

If you consider a battery as an example, it means that the ledwiz would be a switch on the (-) side of the battery. This means that you would have to supply the load (toy) with the (+) voltage and connect the ledwiz output to the (-) side of the toy.

 

In the case of the 20ma led example above, you would run 12v to the led (ignoring the limiting resistor needed) and you would run a wire from the output of the ledwiz to the (-) side of the led.

 

Bank Voltages?????

 

Bank voltages are useless for our applications here.

 

The bank voltage is a means to connect to the built in diode in a ledwiz driver and is supposed to do the same job as an external diode does in the circuit. In reality, the built in diode is far less effective than installing an external diode along the lines of a 1n4001 - 1n4007 diode at the source (across any coil or motor).

 

Leds don't need flyback diodes as they are diodes by their very nature and therefore don't create the flyback voltages that coils do upon collapse of their fields.

 

What controls the ledwiz?????

 

The ledwiz is controlled by signals sent from the computer through the usb cable to the ledwiz. These signal originate (in the case of a virtual pincab) from the software created by SwissLizard and supported by Arngrim (among many others) called Direct Output Framework (DOF).

 

In a nutshell, DOF takes the signals from the ROM of the table being played, translates them from your individual configuration (which output you have connected to what toy) that is usually generated by using an online configuration tool that doesn't exist on here due to conflicts that we won't get into, and ultimately sends those signal out to the ledwiz.

 

I need diagrams!

 

I have a forum section in my site http://www.zebsboard...ndex.php/forum that is devoted to wiring diagrams, example wiring and calculated values for resistors and such. Everyone is welcome to browse it and use what they may. While the diagrams are primarily drawn for the ledwiz and booster boards, for loads under 500ma you can easily remove the booster board from the equation and run directly from the ledwiz.

 

I still don't get it!!!!

 

Perhaps you might be better served purchasing a complete solution from any of the retailers available on this or any other site...

Edited by zebulon, 04 October 2014 - 10:40 PM.

[mjr]

Cool! so once its changed how do I know what channel does what? Thats what im in the dark on this mostly....lets say channel 1 is supposed to be a bumper - how do I know that? And is it common across most tables?

 

That's where the DirectOutput Framework configuration comes in.  If you use Arngrim's online setup tool, you go to the Port Assignments tab to tell the tool which port # controls which device.  The devices correspond to your physical cabinet layout, so you tell it something like Port 1 is the Start button light, Port 2 is the left flipper contactor, Port 3 is the right flipper contactor, Port 4 is the left slingshot contactor, etc.  The tool has just about all of the feedback devices anyone uses.  You just have to do this once for your whole cabinet layout.  Once you have all of your devices mapped to ports, Arngrim's system will automatically generate a config file for you that assigns the right port #'s for your layout for every table in his database (which includes just about every table there is).  You download that file (after installing the DOF software on your PC, of course), and you're all set.  

 

The generated config includes every table in the database, whether or not you have the table installed on your computer, so you almost never need to change anything when you add a new table - it's probably already in your config.  (If a new table gets added to the database, and you wanted to pick up its settings, you would have to go back to the tool and re-generate, of course.  That's pretty rare at this point given that the database is so well populated already.)

 

If you ever add a new toy in the future, you just go back into the tool and add it to your Port Assignments, then re-generate and re-download the file.  Likewise if you ever rewire anything to a different port number or anything like that.

 

Arngrim's tool also lets you do custom device mapping for each table if you want, but you don't have to.  His database already has excellent mappings for nearly every table out there.  I've been using his settings very happily.

Edited by mjr, 04 October 2014 - 11:33 PM.

[Rawd]

Yes - Definitely worth it for the force feedback.   The lights are really growing on me too.

 

If you get really frustrated during install,  you can call Zeb on the phone and act like a baby, and he'll calmly walk you through everything.      Thanks Zeb!

[zebulon]

LMAO...anytime Rawd....

[gigalula]

Yep even if you call a little late LOL ... Sorry Steve for the last call

[zebulon]

Always a pleasure Rob!

[mlenardon]

I must agree Zeb rocks.  He was very patient in helping me set up my feed back kit I installed.  There were a few issues, and he worked hard to ensure I was working as needed.  Being new at this I went with a kit from VirtuaPin for the cab, Zeb's full feedback, a 42", 28" screen, Pin DMD and an old Quad core I had kicking around.  Zeb has some killer hardware solutions that are worth every penny.

 

Between Zeb and Randr I learned a hell of a lot doing my build.  I expect it will take another year of tweaking to get things where I want.  Randr was the king with Bam setup and DOF2 configurations.

 

I love your nudge solution that is very creative and a first.  I also like how you went with small flashers on the sides.  I have used the original Nanotech plunger, the VPin version, mercury switches, and this week hopefully Zebs new plunger.

 

Enjoy your build as it is very nice.

 

Michael

Edited by mlenardon, 06 October 2014 - 11:48 AM.