11 replies to this topic

[rasm]

Hi,

 

I am not skilled well in electrics and train myself simply by trial and error. I really would like to get an suggestion about the need of an additional power supply. Currently I use a one-fits-all power supply from arcadeshop: 

 

 

Details

• 130 Watts
• 9.0 Amps +5V
• 4.0 Amps +12V 
• 1.5 Amps +24V 

I already connected the following toys:

 

Toys +5V

• 6 button bulbs
• 5 RGB LEDs 350ma
• 12cm PC fan

 

Toys +24V

• 4 Siemens Contactors

I am planning to connect more stuff:

1. 3 Chinese solenoids on +12V
2. Shaker Motor
3. Gear Motor
4. Replay Knocker

 

Do I need an additional power supply?

Would it save current load to use LEDs instead of bulbs in my buttons?

 

Thx & Cheers

[vampirolatino2]

I don't think you need more, you will not be using ALL at the same time. (one giant burst)

about the second question, yes you will be saving current with the use of LEDs, find how much it is using those 6 buttons all together ... I think you can drive 6 leds just with the consumption of 1 of those bulbs.

 

 

PS: there is a good friend/member here that knows a lot of Electricity, I think his nick is: zebulon

Edited by vampirolatino2, 01 June 2014 - 12:49 AM.

[zebulon]

You're going to want to use that 5v rail for running flasher leds and front panel button lighting as you'll want the 4 amps from the 12v for the shaker/gear and possibly other toys.

 

You'll probably need at least a 30V, 5A power supply for the knocker depending on the coil that you use. A 26-1200 coil will give you a good, loud response at 30v and around 4a if memory serves.

 

You might be pretty tight on that 24v output as well depending on the contactors you use. If you hold a flipper in and 2 more outputs trigger (like bumpers and slings) at the same time you could use up that 1.5a pretty quickly.

Edited by zebulon, 01 June 2014 - 02:30 AM.

[rasm]

...

PS: there is a good friend/member here that knows a lot of Electricity, I think his nick is: zebulon

 

Thx, vampirolatino2.  Yes, I read a lot of zeb and really like his engagement within the community. I also read a lot of great comments about his boards.

Okay, if LEDs save current load I will replace my bulbs soon.

 

 

...

You'll probably need at least a 30V, 5A power supply for the knocker depending on the coil that you use. A 26-1200 coil will give you a good, loud response at 30v and around 4a if memory serves.

...

 

Oh damn, than I would need a separate dedicated 150Watt supply for a knocker  . Hmmm, I read that a lot of members use a 24V supply to drive a knocker. I also found a 12V/2A knocker assembly, but probably it's anyways too much for my current supply. Damn...

 

...

You might be pretty tight on that 24v output as well depending on the contactors you use. If you hold a flipper in and 2 more outputs trigger (like bumpers and slings) at the same time you could use up that 1.5a pretty quickly.

 

Thx, that could be an explanation that I observed a strange behavior that my four contactors don't react for some time after heavy usage - probably I got too much current load and my supply broke the connection for some time (overload protection).

 

So in the end that means I need more power. Thx for your support.

[zebulon]

Your best bet when it comes to power supplies is to buy something that will provide around 1.5 to 2x the amount of power that you require. It leaves you room to grow but more importantly, it will ensure that you will be operating in a range where the supply will stay reasonably cool and your system will remain stable. With the numbers that you have on your current supply, you're probably running hot and at the end of the range of what it can supply.

Edited by zebulon, 02 June 2014 - 03:41 AM.

[rasm]

Thx. Okay, that means I bought a supply with less power as needed  . I can use the current one for buttons and some 12v toys. Unfortunately I have to deal with limited space in my case, so that I originally preferred to use a single supply. But so what... I could extend the case if needed to mount another supply  .

 

Than I would buy an additional 360 watt supply with 15 amps on a 24v rail.

http://www.ebay.de/i...l-/191190573318

 

I assume that the existing 4 amps on the 12v rail are also very tight to drive a gear and shaker motor and my cheap Chinese solenoids. I read that it will create a lot of heat to transform 24v to 12v to use a bigger 24v supply as 12v fallback. Should I buy two more supplies one 12v and one 24v? That sounds a bit like over-engineering, doesn't it?

[vampirolatino2]

I just have 2 PSU in my (in progress cab) one is 12V and another 24V ... If I need 5v I get them from the IPAC, LEDWIZ or the PSU from the PC.

Why the 2 separated PSU? Only for Isolation. I wanted them separated to distribute power around the widebody cab and more important, if they go caput they don't damange any more than only what they are powering.

 

here is my WIP cab:http://www.hyperspin...uot-DMD-29-quot

you can find a list of all the stuff I'm using.

 

Keep up the good work friend!

Thx. Okay, that means I bought a supply with less power as needed  . I can use the current one for buttons and some 12v toys. Unfortunately I have to deal with limited space in my case, so that I originally preferred to use a single supply. But so what... I could extend the case if needed to mount another supply  .

 

Than I would buy an additional 360 watt supply with 15 amps on a 24v rail.

http://www.ebay.de/i...l-/191190573318

 

I assume that the existing 4 amps on the 12v rail are also very tight to drive a gear and shaker motor and my cheap Chinese solenoids. I read that it will create a lot of heat to transform 24v to 12v to use a bigger 24v supply as 12v fallback. Should I buy two more supplies one 12v and one 24v? That sounds a bit like over-engineering, doesn't it?

 

4amps, for all those things.. yes. You need at least 8Amps for all the stuff you are connecting. (at least with 8Amps you can drive more than 16 "toys")

[rasm]

...

Why the 2 separated PSU?

...

 

Because it's simply to less power for all my toys  .

 

...

4amps, for all those things.. yes. You need at least 8Amps for all the stuff you are connecting. (at least with 8Amps you can drive more than 16 "toys")

 

But I don't want to drive 16 toys on this rail. Because 4 contactors are on the 24v rail and flashers and buttons seek their power from the 5v rail I only have to provide enough current for a gear motor, a shaker and 3-4 Chinese solenoids. Would be the 4 remaing amps enough for 5-6 toys?

[rasm]

...

here is my WIP cab:http://www.hyperspin...uot-DMD-29-quot

you can find a list of all the stuff I'm using.

...

 

Uhhhh wooa - nice build a brand new widebody cab. 

[vampirolatino2]

 

...

Why the 2 separated PSU?

...

 

Because it's simply to less power for all my toys  .

 

...

4amps, for all those things.. yes. You need at least 8Amps for all the stuff you are connecting. (at least with 8Amps you can drive more than 16 "toys")

 

But I don't want to drive 16 toys on this rail. Because 4 contactors are on the 24v rail and flashers and buttons seek their power from the 5v rail I only have to provide enough current for a gear motor, a shaker and 3-4 Chinese solenoids. Would be the 4 remaing amps enough for 5-6 toys?

 

 

I was making the question to myself ... like saying ... why I used two psu?

 

I know you don't want to ... but I see that you are starting to getting "addicted" lol ... and better to have extra power than buying a replacement down the road. I know you have 4 contactors alread, the simens, but you posted you will be using some chinese ones, are those 12v or 24? gear motor will be 12v (remember that you need a relay! too), shaker 12v.

 

Yes 4 remaining amps will be enough to power 8+ more toys.

So to sum this up with current PS

Details

• 130 Watts
• 9.0 Amps +5V
• 4.0 Amps +12V 
• 1.5 Amps +24V

5v for all lights (9A is overkill, so you are 100% there)

 

12v 4 amp (gear, chinese contactors x4, shaker) gear and shaker could consume almost 2A both at the same time, you need to read manufacture details beforehand to know, contactors the same 4 x .5A the 2Amps remaining. Like Zebulon pointed, you will or can be running at max capacity in that 12V line. Only if all the toys connected to the 12v are active at the same time ... and I don't think so, but, better be sure right? The only problem is that when the "juice is over" those that require power will not activate.

 

24v 1.5 amp for 4 simens contactors (solenoids) are not enough when they are activated at the same time. Read the manufacture details, I could be wrong..

 

hope this help!

Edited by vampirolatino2, 03 June 2014 - 11:08 PM.

[rasm]

Thx for the detailed answer. You verify exactly my thoughts:

• 5V over-engineered
• 12V tight
• 24V super-tight

I also thought about a replacement for my PSU, so that I keep more of my limited space. But mixed voltage PSUs are very rare (especially ones with more amps). And on the other side after a short research I noticed that it is expensive and creates much heat to transform the output of one big 24V rail to also provide a 5V and 12V line.

Btw: hehehe yeaaaa, I getting started addicted... 

[freneticamnesic]

More power?