294 replies to this topic

[rob046]

I forgot to leave my thoughts on the beta, & btw since I have an HH please feel free to use me, & I think a couple other members around here have one as well (EDIT: Zablon who just posted is one).

My very first thought when I started playing was that the ball looked a little small. I checked in the editor & sure enough the table length was well over 300 units too tall. Not only does this make the ball look smaller than it should, but it also seems to be messing up some shots a little, as everything is further away than it should be. Then visually the taller length takes away from the widebody look & feel. Normally in VP tables have a tendency to appear wider than they really are, but here its the opposite.
That is the #1 thing I'd like to see fixed if possible, but I'm aware that could be too much work. Or if there is a reason why the table is like this, I'm curious as to the explanation of why.

The shoot again lamp (between flippers) & the extra ball lamp numbers should be switched. The lamp in front of the secret passage (the arrow) should always be on. Even from the second I flick the game on that lamp is on, think of it as one of the GI lamps. Same with the 1st yellow lamp in the attic. You have it as l2. Should be always on (or at least this is how things are with my Ni-Wumpf board).

I'm not spending too much time on the game since it is only a Beta & you have more work to do. Hopefully people keep that in mind with the beta, to not start treating it like a final table to throw into their system. But there definitely are some issues with the gameplay/physics, not sure if there are any switch issues since I've spent limited time on it. I'd be happy to share my tweaks, but of course it would be best if I'd implement them on a more final version of the table.
My changes made the table quite a bit different feeling for sure, but that is what it took to get it to play near how mine does. I'd be curious to see how Zablon feels about my tweaks vs the original beta. Always good to have extra sets of eyes looking at these things. Especially with a unique & more complex older table like HH.

Edited by rob046, 19 May 2012 - 03:54 AM.

[jpsalas]

Well, Rob, why the table is so tall? It has to do with the lower playfield. The lower playfield is made with a ramp, and I wanted tohave some slope on that playfield. So it has to be quite high to compensate for the normal slope. It is 300 units high, then you have the plastics, the bumper, and the normal playfield sits at 400. I don't think I can change that without making the lower playfield too slow compared to the rest of the table.

Thanks for the tips on the lamps, Rob. I saw in the manual that those lamps aren't controlled by the rom, just like the two green lights in the lower playfield. I'll connect them to the GI. And thanks to all the other bug reports, but it was just a beta, something to look at instead of a simple picture. I have already fixed most of the bugs and errors, but the playability is the same, since I haven't a clue how the real one plays (I need to look at some videos ).

Still no clue why the jumping, but it is fixed now, so the ball doesn't jump anymore.

[lettuce]

I forgot to leave my thoughts on the beta, & btw since I have an HH please feel free to use me, & I think a couple other members around here have one as well (EDIT: Zablon who just posted is one).

My very first thought when I started playing was that the ball looked a little small. I checked in the editor & sure enough the table length was well over 300 units too tall. Not only does this make the ball look smaller than it should, but it also seems to be messing up some shots a little, as everything is further away than it should be. Then visually the taller length takes away from the widebody look & feel. Normally in VP tables have a tendency to appear wider than they really are, but here its the opposite.
That is the #1 thing I'd like to see fixed if possible, but I'm aware that could be too much work. Or if there is a reason why the table is like this, I'm curious as to the explanation of why.

JP has always used this size ball on all his table, i have asked many a time for this to be increased in size so it looks like a real sized ball and not a marbelle but he says he is unbale to make it any larger!?, it would seem UncleWilly never has a problem in getting the pinball a large realistic and more authentic to a real life table size so im not sure why JP is unable to do this. Due to this the scale of the ball is smaller than what it should be for the table that it is being played on and thus 'should' make the table harder as the distance between the flippers and the smaller size of the ball is greater.

Please understand that i am not having a go, i am glad that you build so many quality tables JP and am super happy you have made this and continue to enjoy your tables massively, just wish they would have life like size pinballs. Maybe you could asked UW how his able to get the correct scale for the pinballs on all his tables, as he doesnt appear to be limited by the high/ball size problem.

Edited by lettuce, 19 May 2012 - 11:23 AM.

[jpsalas]

OK, I'm not sure how many times I have to repeat that I do not do anything to the table so the balls look small. It is the normal size with a normal image on it. If you want you may replace the image with UW ball, which is darker and looks bigger. That's all you need to do. Nothing more nothing less.

[TedB]

Personally I like the color of the ball like the new tables from JP. Darker colors appear to be less solid on my cabinet. I might even change all my tables to this ball. So basically it is a personal preference. Good thing about VP, if you don't like something about a table, you can change it yourself.

[lettuce]

OK, I'm not sure how many times I have to repeat that I do not do anything to the table so the balls look small. It is the normal size with a normal image on it. If you want you may replace the image with UW ball, which is darker and looks bigger. That's all you need to do. Nothing more nothing less.

And as ive said before its nothing to do with the image that UW or you use i have tired to change the image of the ball from your to the one UW usually use, its the scale of the ball/table thats the problem, obviously UW must make the actual table at a smaller scale to start with than what you do and thus this is what make the ball look bigger

Edited by lettuce, 19 May 2012 - 02:07 PM.

[Zablon]

I think the ball appears small because this table is almost a widebody (not quite?) Might explain why the size seems off too.

[StevOz]

Yes a widebody and with 3 playfield table depths is always going to make the ball appear smaller. You have to remember you are looking at a 2D image representation on a 2D screen of a real life 3D pinball and what your eyes perceive is just that, your perception, which is completely unique to each individual. The only way to adjust that perception is to adjust the backdrop setting and you may get a table view that is more pleasing to your individual perceptions.

Nice looking table JP.

Edited by StevOz, 21 May 2012 - 12:14 PM.

[rob046]

Well, Rob, why the table is so tall? It has to do with the lower playfield. The lower playfield is made with a ramp, and I wanted tohave some slope on that playfield. So it has to be quite high to compensate for the normal slope. It is 300 units high, then you have the plastics, the bumper, and the normal playfield sits at 400. I don't think I can change that without making the lower playfield too slow compared to the rest of the table.

Thanks for the tips on the lamps, Rob. I saw in the manual that those lamps aren't controlled by the rom, just like the two green lights in the lower playfield. I'll connect them to the GI. And thanks to all the other bug reports, but it was just a beta, something to look at instead of a simple picture. I have already fixed most of the bugs and errors, but the playability is the same, since I haven't a clue how the real one plays (I need to look at some videos ).

Still no clue why the jumping, but it is fixed now, so the ball doesn't jump anymore.

Thanks for the explanation. I figured there might of been a reason why this was done. I just had a thought though. Couldn't you make the table smaller than normal but keep those same proportions to allow you to still do what you need to with the lower PF? Keep the table just as tall as you need to but with fewer units. Say 2200x1000 or something like that. This way the ball would appear normal size.
Am I making sense? I have no clue if that will work, just brainstorming a bit.

Anyhow, as I said before those couple things are just things I noticed right off the bat. Maybe there are more bugs but I'm not spending much time with it until you have a more final version, cuz as you said you've already found many of the bugs yourself.
& if you want gameplay advice or just want me to throw my tweaks onto a more final table version, I'd be happy to help. This table is a bit more tricky to nail down the physics on than most in VP, not sure why but it just seems like it is.

[jpsalas]

Yes, Rob, I think the best is to wait for the final version and then you can add your tweaks to the table.

About making the table smaller: this is a wide body, and I'm afraid I'll had to shrink all the objects, so I'll leave it like it is.

Edited by jpsalas, 20 May 2012 - 04:37 AM.

[thewool]

Hey there JP,

just back from holiday and chuffed to see this project is taking shape. The beta link is down but I think you might have done this intentionally. The feedback sounds positive on the whole, looking forward to the final ghostly release!!

Cheers.

[maceman]

...just back from holiday and chuffed to see this project is taking shape.

Did you go anywhere cool?


...wait'll you see the next Beta...it is stunning. Just some fine tuning coming by JP and this baby is going to be released . So exciting. It has been a while in waiting it seems!

I'm glad Rob is having a look-see on this as well because he owns the table and knows the physics!!

{{woot, LA just scored , sorry, i am hooked on the Stanley Cup presently....what a game this game 5}

[CaptainNeo]

looking forward to it.

[thewool]

Hello Maceman - I went to Turkey. Yeah it was cool but they have never heard of pinball

I managed to download Farsight's Funhouse over a shitty internet connection. Took over an hour for one table but it kept me going....

Hope you also had a good break dude!

[g00se]

Awesome pin JP!! ---really amazing!!

I hope you put a Black-Hole on your to-do list :-)