31 replies to this topic

[Dilbflo]

Hi all.

I have Visual Pinball installed and working correctly. Recently I read a lot about Future Pinball and BAM. I downloaded the 2 in 1 package from .ravarcade.pl, then tried to install it and run some tables.

The problem is that Bam starts correctly, I can choose a table (I tried with the demo tables and with one downloaded, Sittin' Pretty), but when I try to play the table, I only obtain a CDT without any error message.

As I said, I read a lot of guides and tutorials, with several suggestions (the rendering options, the Windows 8 compatibility and so on), but at present none of them worked.

My system is the following:

 

-Windows 10 Pro

- I9-9900 (not K)

- 32 GB Ram

- Nvidia 1660 Super

 

Do you have any suggestion?

Thanks.

[johnsypin]

i had similar problems with my windows 10 setup that had ran fine on windows 7.

certain tables would crash to desktop half way into loading, the solution to my problem was to not use the modified future pinball "no watermark".exe"i had  previously been using without issue on windows 7. for some strange reason windows 10 wont load certain tables through this .exe while others still work fine.

after a reinstall of future pinball+bam from ravercade.pl i noticed all tables worked again untill i tried to patch in the "no watermark" .exe again.

windows 10 does not seem to like the doctored "no watermark".exe

 

also its worth noteing that windows 10 handles scaling differently and has many options to cover this and future pinball was over the edge of my screen even when set to 1080p

this is fixed by right clicking on the .exe under the compatibility tab and ticking the lower box within the "change high dpi" settings.

tick the box that says "high dpi scaling overide"

 

after upgrading to windows 10 there were also now a few errors loading some vpx visual pinball tables.

these were fixed by moving a mouse onto the backglass screen and clicking, the backglass settings appear here.

at the center is an option to click start in exe to on or off. each vpx error table then worked fine again with no errors after switching the "start in .exe" on or off

[GeorgeH]

Interesting.  I think the main reason that the alternate FP exe files were used was to remove the splash and watermark.  You can do that now without using the alternate exe's.  I have attached a zip file to my guide here.  To remove the Future Pinball logo from the table loading screen, save the attached "default.zip" to the following folder:

 

C:\Games\Future Pinball\BAM

 

The in-game Future Pinball logo can be removed in BAM by opening the in-game BAM menu, usually by pressing the ` (key the left of the 1 key) or "Q" key. Then, arrow down to the "Addons" menu item and press "enter". Then, arrow down to "Hide FP logo" and right arrow to change it to "<On". By having this option turned on, you will have the logo appear for a few seconds and then it will disappear.

[Dilbflo]

Hi.

Thanks for the answer and the further indications.

In my case, at present I simply installed BAM and FP with the 2 in 1 file by ravarcade, without any watermark modifications.

By making other tests, I discovered that I can use the tables if at start I launch "Future Pinball.exe" instead than "FPLoader.exe". If I understood the situation, in this way I use the "old" FP without the improvements introduced by BAM. Is this correct?

I also noticed that, when launching "Future Pinball.exe", I can use my two monitor setup, with the backglass on the secondo monitor, Anyway, at least with Sittin' Pretty, the backglass on the second monitor is not "active", the score is updated only in the background of the first monitor.

I will continue my tests, if you have suggestions they are welcome.

Thanks

Edited by Dilbflo, 09 February 2022 - 11:24 AM.

[GeorgeH]

As far as I know, neither FP nor BAM has a Computer Diagnostics Test if in fact that is what you are talking about.  Do you have some other front end program installed?  You might provide a screenshot of it.    

[Dilbflo]

Hi GeorgeH.

I don't have any other frontend for FP. For tests I was simply meaning that I am making other attempts.

Today I uninstalled the program(s), and tried to VERY carefully read your guides about FP and BAM. This time I tried to use the separate installers. Unfortunately, the end results seem the same. Future Pinball alone works well (obviously with the tables that don't require the advanced features). Then I tried to install the latest BAM  (BAM v1.5-341.zip) from ravarcade. When launching FPLoader.exe and opening any table, the program closes itself without any message, as before.

So the problem is surely with BAM, but I don't have idea which can be the cause.

Do you have any suggestion, eventual other passages?

 

Thanks, also for your very detailed guides.

[GeorgeH]

BAM will crash if you have model quality set to anything other than high but you probably got that if you read my guide. 

 

Sorry I ran out of ideas.  

[Dilbflo]

Hi GeorgeH,

yes, I checked to have model quality set to high, as indicated in your guide.

I have an update. Considering that my problem seems clearly related to BAM, I dug further in the archives of ravarcade, containing the old versions of BAM. I discovered an interesting thing. The most recent version of BAM that works correctly on my system is the BAM_v1.4-135.zip, [29 sep 2016]. Starting with the BAM_v1.4-154.zip, [20 feb 2017] I get the crash as soon as I open a table.

So I would like to ask a pair of questions:

- Are there significant improvements in the latest versions of BAM after 2016?

- Do you know if after 2016 some particular changes have been introduced, that can make my system crash? (it is a quite recent PC from 2020, so it seems a bit strange, but probably there is some hidden incompatibility with BAM versions after 2016).

 

Thanks for the help.

[GeorgeH]

@ravarcade

 

Can you help Dilbflo in the previous post?  I can't answer it.  

 

George

 

 

Rav will probably ask for your BAM crash log.  You open it in Notepad located here:

 

C:\Games\Future Pinball\BAM\BAM_CRASH.log

 

I can't understand it but Rav can.  

[johnsypin]

in answer to dilbflos question, yes future pinball still will work fine on its own and yes that is without the improvements of bam, but i found that bam is a very necesarry thing to have running as it gives a much better perspective for cabinet users and allows for awesome tweaks to the gamma and lighting. it really brings old future pinball to life i cant imagine going back to using flat old future pinball on its own. also slamtilt says that all his latest tables need it to run.

 

thanks to the george h  who said about logo removal for cabinets i will look into that.

 

after much messing around with it i got it to run again following slamtilts  recommended setup found on his site

 

https://speak1970.wi...llemporium/help

 

but find myself in a very strange scenario.

 

there are 3 tables which still crash straight after loading, f 14 tomcat (one of my favorite tables). casino royale and thundercats.

however, and this is the oddest thing ive ever come across in my years of pc tinkering.... these tables will load after any other working table...but only once.

if i close the fp loader and try it again it fails 2 seconds after loading.

they will then only work again after loading another working table again such as elm street or apollo 13 or any working table but only as long as its in the editor,

if i close it then load again it fails. this happens with those 3 tables

 

any ideas chaps ?

Edited by johnsypin, 10 February 2022 - 08:06 PM.

[johnsypin]

UPDATE.

 

dilbflo youre a legend. your idea about reverting back to 1.4-135 has worked on my cabinet.

no more strange crashes after loading right once. im so glad i read this post today because as a last resort i had also tried to downgrade the bam versions from the archive on ravercade....but i hadnt gone back as far as 1.4-135, i had given up after trying a few older versions

 

1.4-135 works as it used to work with no crashes.

 

i will be very cautious about updating bam from now on.

 

thanks to all the guys for your suggestions

 

anyone wanting slamtilts modified exes can find them here http://www.pinsimdb....xecutable_files

[ravarcade]

@Dilbflo
I will revert question: where is difference betrwee your computer, installed software and setting and hundrets of other users?
 

Right now i'm at begin of game in 20 questions

 

At first lets start from begin:

0. Test your computer with any 3d mark, like free fire strike. Just to verify, that your computer is working correctly.

1. You should install BAM from 2-in-1 installer.

2. ... current version... v.341, not alder one, don't "mix" files with older version.

3. ... on drive c: (main computer drive, no pendrives, no network drives on another computer, no NAS storage)

4. ... in normal direct. Default is: "c:\games\future pinball". It can be: "c:\testing" or something like this, but nothing on desktop, documents or anything in "c:\users\...". No system dirs like "c:\Windows" or "c:\program files". 

5. ... do not change, replace any file in that director

6. ... do not add any file (all tweaking tools, own opengl.dll or something like this are banned)

7. ... i just don't want to find after 10 questions, that you added "shaderfx", "future dmd" .... you may play with all that tools later.

8. install gfx card driver from nvidia.com

9. do not play with options like super resolution, dlss or something like this ... again, you may play with all that fancy tweaks later

10. Run FPLoader.exe with admin rights and for start try just plain empty FP table. 

 

You can probably do 100 other things I haven't thought of. I just wan't to eliminate most common sources of problems.. 

 

So, lets start with questions:

1. i need screenshot of FP video/rendering options (just to be sure, you did not set something wird)

2. i need gfx card drive version. (default installed with windows are almost for sure broken).... i want to be sure, that you did not try to cheat me at point 7 .

3. Antivirus/Antimalware programs.... if BAM crash, first thing to check is to disable all that stuffs. I'm not testing BAM with all that AV programs updates. 

4. If BAM crash... i need to look at BAM_CRASH.LOG.

[TerryRed]

Be sure you have all Visual C++ installed for BAM to work right (reboot after install)

 

https://www.techpowe...age-all-in-one/

 

You can also try following my FP and BAM Mega Guide as well. I highly recommend you use the settings shown in there, and if you are a cabinet user, the BAM cfg files are very handy.

 

https://pinballnirva...terryred.20407/

 

- DO NOT use modified FP EXEs. There is no longer any reason to ever use them.

- DO not set the FuturePinball.exe to run as administrator.

- You may need to run FPLoader.exe (BAM) as administrator at least once (or permanently), and some have said they need to set it to Windows 8 compatibility.

- Windows Defender MUST be disabled (too many problems because of it)

- Make sure your video cards and sound drivers are up to date. Windows will install its own drivers (after a Windows update) which causes problems for many apps. Manually download and install the latest drivers for both!

- If you have multiple monitors on your setup, FP MUST be set to display on the primary monitor, and any other monitors must be positioned to the right of FP in Windows display settings.

- Run from FPLoader.exe directly to load FP tables. Don't trust desktop icons or start menu as they may point to the FP exe and not BAM exe.

- ALWAYS completely close FP EVERY TIME when you exit out of a table (even if you want to reload the same table), or you want to load and play another table.

 

The newest version of BAM is "required" for all the newer tables being released... so it's in your interest to have FP setup correctly...and BAM working correctly.

Edited by TerryRed, 10 February 2022 - 09:13 PM.

[Dilbflo]

Hi all.

I have good news.

First of all, thanks to all the friendly guys that are participating in this thread. I am new here, but I am discovering a very kind atmosphere, really appreciated.

Second, I finally found the problem (it seems). While making my experiments with various settings and versions of BAM, I continued to scout the web for further possible hints. I found only a pair of references to a little nasty gremlin, until now unkonwn to me: the "Nahimic driver". Apparently this is an "advanced" audio driver that should improve the sound of applications. In practice, as reported by various sources, it creates several compatibility problems. Furthermore, I didn't remember to have never installed it. And actually it seems that it is "forced" during Windows updates, to the owners of particular hardware. In my case it was the motherboard, an Asus Maximus XI Hero (Wi-Fi). The irony is that this motherboard was just indicated for gamers...

Lo and behold, as soon as I stopped the various Windows processes related to Nahimic, suddenly no more BAM crashes, instead tables correctly loaded and running. Furthermore, and this can be useful also to johnsypin, no more need for old versions of BAM, now the latest one works well.

I will continue to verify with other tables, but it seems that now my problem with the crashes is gone.

I hope that this report can be useful to others that may have received the driver update without notice and experience the strange BAM crash.

Thanks again to all, now I will dig in your wonderful work and guides about FP and BAM.

Edited by Dilbflo, 11 February 2022 - 01:35 PM.

[TerryRed]

Thanks for sharing about the pita "Nahimic driver". I never even heard about this driver until Wagner mentioned it on his ALP Guide for FP. Seems to be a problem for not just FP, but other apps as well.

 

Its seems to be included with typical Dell / HP type of PCs....and everyone says it should be removed.

 

If FP is properly setup... most problems tend to come from Windows / driver issues.

[GeorgeH]

UPDATE.

 

dilbflo youre a legend. your idea about reverting back to 1.4-135 has worked on my cabinet.

no more strange crashes after loading right once. im so glad i read this post today because as a last resort i had also tried to downgrade the bam versions from the archive on ravercade....but i hadnt gone back as far as 1.4-135, i had given up after trying a few older versions

 

1.4-135 works as it used to work with no crashes.

 

i will be very cautious about updating bam from now on.

 

thanks to all the guys for your suggestions

 

anyone wanting slamtilts modified exes can find them here http://www.pinsimdb....xecutable_files

 

Are you using the "Nahimic driver" that Dilbflo reported above?  I had never heard of it myself.  There are quite a few tables that won't work with old versions of BAM.  All the table mods I have done within the last few years require at least version 267.  In fact, I produce a message on the screen if you use anything less than that.  Slamt1lt's recent "Ultimate Pro" tables probably won't work either.  Terry says that the alternate exe files can cause problems on a cabinet.  You might look at my response above on how to disable the FP logo and switch back to the original exe.  

[johnsypin]

thanks guys and dilbflo for all your input, it seems like a subject where alot of heads are better than one to get to the bottom of this problem.

i will certainly be looking into this pap nahimic driver as i too have an asus motherboard that was at the time marketed as a "gaming" motherboard.

 

i will point out that the latest bam did in fact work but  just didnt want a bar of a few select tables.....one of which "f 14 tomcat" one of my favorites so it was a sacrafice i was not prepared to make

 

and to george h thanks for the heads up i had assumed that slamtilts latest tables would require a bang up to date BAM version.

ive not updated my table files in a little while but after some searching, mr slamtilts ultimate pro tables is where my sights are fixed for the next future pinball tables.

 

i read hes done a last action hero table which will be good on future pinball, i have the vpx version but i do prefer future pinball over all, better muic, better sounds and BAM 3d perspective capabilities. all good stuff.

 

slamtilts ultimate pro tables are listed here  https://speak1970.wi...pinballemporium

 

the future looks bright chaps

Edited by johnsypin, 11 February 2022 - 04:15 PM.

[johnsypin]

today ive been looking into the audio driver issue that dilbflo points out.

i believe there to be a BIG issue here which IS effecting my setup and possibly others too. all research i have done points to this driver being the cause of many crashes on many gamers systems.

many otheres like dilbflo say that if you can gain back control of your audio and cut out this nihamic driver your problems will be over.

wondering what this could mean i delved deeper into my audio.

 

i made a rather alarming descovery, my realtek HD audio has always shown in the windows volume section for switching to but its own manager utility and start up icon do not show on the taskbar, if i go to startup through task manager it is enabled in there but doesnt show up.

so i checked the realtek program files and the manager wont load from its own exe there either.

 

since this recent upgrade to windows 10 i could see it in the windows taskbar volume section but had always assumed that it was there and working but its not at all.....no utility,....no manager.

im betting my bottom dollar that the nihamic driver or somthing like it is blocking it from working or installing.

i have tried to reinstall the realtek HD audio driver for my chip but at the point where it is supposed to restart before completing the install it looses the install and wont complete. after restarting the icon and utility should be there but it just goes back to square one with no utilty, no icon and no manager to load and control.

 

how can i remove the nihamic driver ? its not listed anywhere but the strange thing is, there are 2 HD audio devices listed in device manager.. the other one is not named. is this it ?

[wiesshund]

One of the devices may in fact be your HDMI port as those carry audio

 

If you right click the device in device manager and choose to uninstall, and if prompted uninstall software for device, it will remove all manufacturer's drivers

and when PC reboots, it will load with the generic MS drivers

 

Now as far as the reset, which is the realtek chip mother your motherboard uses

 

You could try these 3rd party drivers

Releases · AlanFinotty/AAFRealtekMod · GitHub

 

And you dont need to install the extra audio stuff it comes with like

•  Nahimic 3
•  A-Volute Sonic Studio 3 (ASUS ROG)
•  Dolby Atmos
•  Creative Sound Blaster Connect 2
•  

[johnsypin]

its ok wiesshund i sorted it today. dilbflo was right about the crashes being audio driver related.

heres how i did it.

windows 10 absolutely would not allow installation of a realtek hd audio driver even though the realtek chip is my used hardware

upon digging further into this i realised that although some pcs share the same realtek chip number, there are realtek drivers that associate with specific manufacturers hardware or motherboards.

in my case yes i required windows 10 realtek hd audio drivers for the ALC 887....but the usual realtek drivers that many people use would not instal.

i actualy needed an ASUS/realtek version of the driver.

upon digging even further into it i found that in cases like this you can download a Realtek HDA driver package that covers many different makes and models and will auto install the correct driver for whichever manufacturers hardware you have.

it installed straight away. the crash still was there but thats ok because now you have full control of your audio you can do away with the mystery driver that was causing the problems by going to device manager and disableing or uninstalling it.

 

bish bash bosh, job done.................all tables are working fine again with the very latest BAM, even one that used to crash randomly on windows 7, stern star wars.

all the ultimate pro tables work fine....great physics improvements there.

 

id like to thank every one in this thread for their help with the rocky road to windows 10. we got there in the end

 

thanks to

 

george h

dilbflo

terry red

ravarcade

and wiesshund

 

@ravarcade. its deffinately audio related, windows likes its driver or the nahimic driver to be the main driver even after a successfull audio driver install.

once this other driver is disabled or uninstalled....just like dilbflo says ALL is fine again.

 

BAM is an awesome program i couldnt live without it. keep up the great work.

 

cheers to ravarcade for making the best damn pinball simulation addon out there, cheers to george h for earlyer and for if you are the same george h who co wrote the best table in my cabinet......apollo 13. cant beat a bit of 13 ball multiball and the sounds and graphics are perfect, feels really cool in a cabinet.

Edited by johnsypin, 13 February 2022 - 07:06 AM.