50 replies to this topic

[settingsons]

I come across this video on Youtube of a Virtual pinball cabinet that looks like it is running software which isn't VP or FP. Anyone know anything about it?

BIFUCA PINBALL TRONIC DIGITAL 2010

I found a bit more on it, on Pinball News....
Pinball News

Edited by settingsons, 05 May 2011 - 09:41 PM.

[faralos]

pretty crappy looking pf's! I love the cabs though! wonder if you can buy just an empty cab? i like that pinball emulator ride that one looks cool too! to be a ball rolling around a pin... too cool! as for that ball jam I can reproduce that one with just about any of my older pins! it is a line of code that keeps numerous balls from appearing in the plunger lane. Apparently the programmer forgot to put it in and someone hit the start button again! too cheap looking for FP and too flat and cartoony for VP I have no idea but I bet it's just stand-alone software made especially for those pins by the looks of it.

[destruk]

Super Hero - Stern Spiderman
Mad Professor - Williams Fish Tales
At least Noah's Ark looks like it could be an original game - not many real machines have 5 flippers on the main playfield.

[rob046]

pretty crappy looking pf's! I love the cabs though! wonder if you can buy just an empty cab? i like that pinball emulator ride that one looks cool too! to be a ball rolling around a pin... too cool! as for that ball jam I can reproduce that one with just about any of my older pins! it is a line of code that keeps numerous balls from appearing in the plunger lane. Apparently the programmer forgot to put it in and someone hit the start button again! too cheap looking for FP and too flat and cartoony for VP I have no idea but I bet it's just stand-alone software made especially for those pins by the looks of it.

Looks like VP to me. Especially on the closeup pic ("getting stuck"). Those screw head models look just like the ones people make for VP.
Or maybe it is a modified version of VP. I just have a feeling these guys wouldn't have created pinball software from scratch just to make a few tables for a cab they likely won't sell much of.

Here is the english link to this product, it is also in the PDF that is in the catalog link...
http://www.bifuca.es/en/_home.htm

[jpsalas]

Yes, it is running VP, they even used my Spider-Man table without permission to make their Super Hero, it even still have the JP logo on the flippers, as you can see in this video:



Not very happy about it.

[Noah Fentz]

Yeah, that's more than obvious.

I'm only English-speaking. What is being said? They seem to be pointing to the flippers a lot, as if to say it's nothing but a cheap ripoff of your great work, JP.



EDIT - I decided to download a file they have ... Fish Tales Update, here's what I got ...



How sad is that? I wonder if Randy is even aware of this.


EDIT EDIT - The T2 is PacDude's from VPFreeForums and the 'Fishing Day' is Melon's Fish Tales. Clearly stated in the Table Info, no less.

[rob046]

Yes, it is running VP, they even used my Spider-Man table without permission to make their Super Hero, it even still have the JP logo on the flippers, as you can see in this video:



Not very happy about it.

Yeah that confirms what I already figured.
I wouldn't worry too much, I don't think these guys are gonna be selling many (if any) of these cabs. That is the downside of VP & its tables being free & open source & isn't the first or last time somebody is gonna take tables & mod them without permission, even in an attempt to make a buck, & they could probably care less because they don't intend to host the tables here. The real bummer is that at least in the past when people would try to sell VP & tables on ebay, we could report them & they aren't allowed to do that. But in this case, they are selling a cabinet, & could just say that the tables come free with it. Anybody know the legalities of stuff like this? & in this case maybe it is tricky, because they put original art on these tables that used to have trademarked art on them, this has always been a loophole to be able to use & sell existing designs from BLY/WMS/Stern (see Pinball FX). So perhaps they can do this & try to sell cabs. However, anybody with half a brain wouldn't buy them.

Just too bad these guys aren't putting their time into actual table building for the community & doing it the right way, because they do have at least some artistic talent that would be welcomed here. But clearly they just want to make a quick buck, it is damn near a scam. Ever since I first heard about ultrapin I figured things like this would keep happening. You are putting a price now on a hobby that used to be 100% free, & now with cabs & ultrapin's (& this thing) it can be monetized.
At least we already know that these tables certainly won't be available here. Though I don't doubt some FS users probably want them now!

[Noah Fentz]

I can say with 100% certainty that VP isn't freeware and cannot be distributed freely with a commercial product without Randy's approval, the Fish Tales clone and T2 violate WMS IP, and they are also including VPM and ROMs, if this works 'out of the box'!

So, needless to say, they are violating a few copyright laws.

Note: I don't think you can reskin a table and call it original. Data East tried to do that with LW3 and got popped for cloning T2. It cost them seven figures.

[jpsalas]

The video was taken from a friend and he just points out that he can see who made that game, even the flippers has the logo. He didn't know that they only took my Spider-Man table and changed it.

[destruk]

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[settingsons]

When I posted this, at first I thought 'great another company supporting pinball', and in the end it turns out to be another bunch of crooks. Shame.

Edited by settingsons, 06 May 2011 - 05:14 PM.

[kruge99]

Lets hope they are infested by the pinball vampires and zombies who will suck the life out of them so that their business crumbles...

[chriz]

how presumptuous are these guys? the only good thing is that their cab looks like crap

[007]

Lets hope they are infested by the pinball vampires and zombies who will suck the life out of them so that their business crumbles...

The dreaded Pinball Zombie Curse!

A suitable punishment, indeed.

[faralos]

as far as i know any time one tries to sell a pin with a commercial rom in it they are breaking copyright laws since I am quite certain they are not paying any royalties to Stern of any of the other commercial pin companies. also although I make mine for free it would be nice if someone who sold it could if not give me money at least give me the credit of building that particular pin. You guys must be pissed yet this does happen often. Case in point that site i made noise about like 6 months back, he at least put the vpf site on his front page since he also sells cabs with vp in them! maybe I can get these guys to do that at least but I doubt it. I don't speak whatever language that is (spanish?) But I'll give it the ol' college try again...can't hurt...

Edited by faralos, 06 May 2011 - 05:55 PM.

[destruk]

The PinMAME dev team is considering licensing vpm for their product, and we'll probably need to consult with MAMEDev again, the table authors involved are being contacted, and Randy Davis was emailed about it as well. So we'll let you know what's going on. As some machines have already been sold it makes everything much more complicated than it should have been.

The youtube videos are removed.

Edited by destruk, 06 May 2011 - 06:07 PM.

[destruk]

Randy said he worked out a deal with them three months ago for this product. So they're ok to use VP. The tables, roms, and vpm are a separate matter though.

[faralos]

I sent them an email earlier letting them know of the possible copyright infringements, hope to hear back from them!

[Noah Fentz]

Faralos, no offense, but you should probably leave things like this to proper representation.

[destruk]

Just for those concerned here - Bifuca have agreed to these terms - they will include instructions with their cabinets to download Visual PinMAME from the pinmame.com website and customers will install that themselves. Furthermore, they will not include tables preinstalled on their cabinets in the future - table files will be available on their website as they are modified for their cabinet - and they will provide a link or instructions to get additional tables from vpforums.org

The tables they were including preinstalled:

Super Hero 'Spiderman" JPSalas
Frankenstein "Canasta86" JPSalas
Fish Tales "Fishing Day" Melon
Agent Double "Lethal Weapon" Joep, PinGod, NEDO, MOD by el_timbo
Getaway Noah/UR
The Adams' Family PacDude
Indiana Jones
T2 Noah/UR

Edited by destruk, 24 May 2011 - 09:52 PM.