2044 replies to this topic

[Rawnei]

Even better, it seems to run fine with SS 150% now. I only played around with different ways to set the SS (from Steam, from Oculus Tray Tool and from Oculus debug tool). I'm absolutely sure I only had it set to more than 1.0 from only one place before too, but just went through all these apps and tested to set them all to 1.0 to verify (visually) that SS is off and then retried to set 1.5 factor from each of them separately. Result was seemingly identical every time. Got smooth gameplay and still had ~45% performance headroom (when I tested SS with ODT which was otherwise off to prevent it from overriding SS setting from other apps). Did not test SS from Nvidia settings. 

It's a bit unclear what the processing order is with this many places to affect the same setting (5 in total). Also one of these seem to override VPXVR setting as setting Quality SMAA to 1.5 does not work at all in my case.

 

They will all be additive, for example if you set 150% in Oculus or Steam and then 150% in VPVR as well it will actually be 225% because VPVR will ask the SteamVR API for the HMD's resolution which will already be supersampled and then it will apply it's own supersample based off the resolution that was returned, that's why you only want it one place.

[sniiki]

 

Even better, it seems to run fine with SS 150% now. I only played around with different ways to set the SS (from Steam, from Oculus Tray Tool and from Oculus debug tool). I'm absolutely sure I only had it set to more than 1.0 from only one place before too, but just went through all these apps and tested to set them all to 1.0 to verify (visually) that SS is off and then retried to set 1.5 factor from each of them separately. Result was seemingly identical every time. Got smooth gameplay and still had ~45% performance headroom (when I tested SS with ODT which was otherwise off to prevent it from overriding SS setting from other apps). Did not test SS from Nvidia settings. 

It's a bit unclear what the processing order is with this many places to affect the same setting (5 in total). Also one of these seem to override VPXVR setting as setting Quality SMAA to 1.5 does not work at all in my case.

 

They will all be additive, for example if you set 150% in Oculus or Steam and then 150% in VPVR as well it will actually be 225% because VPVR will ask the SteamVR API for the HMD's resolution which will already be supersampled and then it will apply it's own supersample based off the resolution that was returned, that's why you only want it one place.

 

Yup, know that and like mentioned was sure that it is set over 1.0 from only one place earlier. Still one of these seem to override VPX setting on my setup as it has no effect if rest is set to 1.0 / 100%. Not sure if it matters at all from where it is set, that is if super sampling is done equally efficiently in all of these options(?)

Edited by sniiki, 09 November 2019 - 07:30 PM.

[blindpeser]

And the best has yet to come. Hooefully there will be feedback/rumble this fall. DDH69 made a stunning job so far.

[gear323]

Yeah, Virus & threat protection settings -> Manage settings -> Real-time protection. Rest of the options can be left on if wanted. Note that this setting will restore automatically to on position after reboot. To permanently disable it, group policies need to be edited.

 

This solution came just in time as I got my VR cabinet on its legs. Total cost 70€ as I only had to purchase legs and buy some metal look vinyl wrap for the lockbar that I carved from oak using small chinese cnc router. Body was built from scrapped Ikea furnitures and electronics I stole from dust collecting old virtual pinball cabinet. Need to revise my plunger assembly. If only the VR had been available year ago, would have saved so much money and time but better now than never! Even after all the praises on this thread I feel this has not got the attention it deserves. This really feels so close to the real thing especially on these new tables with outstanding physics settings. Also, CV for example has what I think is the best ball rolling sound so far and it adds a lot to make the ball "feel" heavy.

 

 

I think it is kind of crazy that there are still some people building the 3 monitor flat screen cabinets.  VR blows those away in my opinion, especially if you have a mini cabinet with force feedback and it will only get better.  I sold my VP pinball cabinet and still glad i did as it took up so much room and pinball on a flat screen is just not that much fun compared to VR.  It's also so nice that my Pinsim fits in my closet so it is out of the way when not needed.     

 

I'm also still hoping that Pinball FX 3 releases all of the Williams tables that they have been creating in VR. Their Pinball FX2 VR is pretty fun and the physics updates they have done with the Williams tables are actually pretty good. It would be also be much easier for "normies" to get it installed and up and running and you don't have to exit VR to change tables!    They monitor their Pinball FX3 Facebook page pretty closely so the more people that comment about VR the better    

 

Pinball FX3 Facebook Homepage:

https://www.facebook...f=page_internal

 

And the best has yet to come. Hooefully there will be feedback/rumble this fall. DDH69 made a stunning job so far.

 

I really hope they add adjustable native Ximput force feedback as well.  Really this should probably be added to VPX though, not just VPXVR since this would be a great addition for people that are still playing on a monitor as well. 

Edited by gear323, 09 November 2019 - 09:04 PM.

[sniiki]

And the best has yet to come. Hooefully there will be feedback/rumble this fall. DDH69 made a stunning job so far.

 

I'll just throw my DOF setup (solenoids and a shaker) in there and top it with a surface vibration speaker attached to the lockbar to get the ball roll ffb too. Probably will modify solenoids to a bit quieter as I prefer the canned sounds with headphones and thus only need the vibration from solenoids.

 

I think it is kind of crazy that there are still some people building the 3 monitor flat screen cabinets.  VR blows those away in my opinion, especially if you have a mini cabinet with force feedback and it will only get better.  I'm also still hoping that Pinball FX 3 releases all of the Williams tables that they have been creating in VR. Their Pinball FX2 VR is pretty fun and the physics updates they have done with the Williams tables are actually pretty good.   

Fully agree on VR vs traditional cabinet. FX3 physics even with the Williams table updates still seem inferior to VPX tho, but heading to right direction for sure.

Edited by sniiki, 09 November 2019 - 08:59 PM.

[WilsonB]

Played around with the TOTAN VR version yesterday. It's beautiful on my Oculus Rift. 

 

Is there an overview somewhere on this site where all VR versions are listed? AFAIK we now have:

- AC-DC Premium VR

- TOTAN VR

- TAF VR

- CSI VR

 

Maybe the forum needs a new section in the VPX tables dropdown?

 

Ya, would be nice if there was a specific section in main dedicated to VP VR..Links to all VR tables,  Including recommend settings and what should be turned off/on..

[WilsonB]

Guys.. This is a Game changer..

 

flupper1 in the Netherlands! Awesome work..I would buy you a beer...(Austin, TX) ;-)

 

Finally got it up and running with X-Arcade TankStick..

Here you can find a video demo of Arabian nights with my configuration. 

https://youtu.be/6ToyN1IXVfY

 

Guys Please post your Arabian nights configuration/ recmmendations using an Oculus.

 

My question is;

1.) The Audio is not coming out mixed correctly. The physics audio is very high(flipper, ball, etc.) and the actual table sound effect(Table voice/music) is extremely low.

Where to change it?

 

2.) Also, the graphics look a little pixelated when farther away. Going up close it looks beautiful.

 

3.) I assume each table has it's own configuration saved when exiting(and agreeing to it.) How to back that config file up/share in case I mess it up?

 

4.) Multi-ball it starts to lag.

 

5.) The colors need to be toned down just a little..

 

Note: I made the table ref. bigger and higher. I also had to figure out how to reset and assign a button to re-center to be directly in front of Virtual table while standing directly in front of X-Arcade tank stick. Works great.

Edited by WilsonB, 10 November 2019 - 03:26 AM.

[gear323]

Wilson, you need to open the coin door on the pinball table and then adjust the audio in the ROM. 

 

Load the table TOTAN but do not start a game.   Press the "END" key on your keyboard to open the coin door then press "9" for volume up and "8" for volume down.    Don't put the audio too loud or you may get distortion / popping sounds.  My recommendation is to set the table volume to 26.

Enjoy

Edited by gear323, 10 November 2019 - 07:46 AM.

[flupper1]

Wilson, in the video the contrast seems or is (too) high, for instance the floor is not visible. On the HTC vive this is not the case, can you see the floor tiles properly when wearing the quest?

[dbknightx]

I just wanted to add my sincere thanks to the many people that have brought VPX in VR to reality.  This is a COMPLETE game changer, and I hope it will be taken seriously by the VPX devs and that it will help to drive the future direction of VPXI.  Once you've experienced this properly, there is no way that a flat screen can be satisfying again.

 

Quick background: Long time pinball machine owner (since 2000).  Discovered VP in around March this year and thought it would be a great project.  Built a wide body cabinet from scratch (43" 4K / 32" 1080p).  Full SSF.  All original pinball parts.  I'm still tweaking the software on it (been a 6 month project) but I think I've got it about as good as it can be - but it has been lacking something.  I found out about this project and hoped that a Kinect implementation would satisfy me, but it still doesn't look right.  I've had an HTC Vive for several years collecting dust, so thought I'd try this in VR.  It was really neat but I almost wrote it off because the resolution and detail was so low.  I spent some more time on it, tweaking SS and other settings.

 

Then I downloaded Flupper1's amazing TOTAN VR version and was BLOWN AWAY.  That table has always been one of my favorites on my cab but in VR I could swear I was playing the real machine (I used to own a TOTAN and completely restored it, so am very familiar with it).  Even with an XBOX controller I put up a higher score than I had in many hours on my cab.  I actually couldn't stop playing it the experience was so amazing - loved watching the ball go around the orbits, up the ramp and drop into the pops.  The detail in the cabinet, backbox, environment - all outstanding.  I can even read the DMD much better than I was able to on other VR tables.  This completely turned me around.  I'm going to sell my full-size cabinet and go all in on VR.

 

I'm planning on a Valve Index upgrade (after I sell my Vive), but the other thing I'd like to spend some time on and get right is the "pin stubby".  I'm going to forgo the LED buttons and other bling, but will definitely use a standard lockdown bar, leaf switch buttons, basically want it to feel EXACTLY like my cabinet does.  Where I'd like to get some advice is on the tactile and audio feedback.

 

1)  Tactile:  Currently leaning towards putting 8 Siemens contractors spaced around the cabinet (2 flipper, 2 sling, 4 pops).  However I have a nice SSF setup in my current cab and am wondering if I should go with a 2.1 SSF (2 exciters and a bass shaker) instead.  These would provide some table sounds too, but it wouldn't be as positional as the 4 exciters and 2 shakers in my current cab.

 

2)  Audio:  Not thrilled with the audio on my HTC Vive DAS headset and would love for at least table sounds to come from the table direction.  Has anybody given any thought about how to improve the audio in VR?  Perhaps investing in better headphones would do the trick.  Am also considering adding some audio to the pinstubby itself.

 

I look forward to there eventually being a proper VR front end.  In fact, I'd love to help out in that endeavor if anybody has started work on something (I've developed software for 25+ years).

 

I can't wait to see what comes next!

[gear323]

Since you are thinking about getting the index...

I have the Valve index and the audio is really good. For me at least, I’m happy with hearing all the sounds from the table inside the index headset and just really hoping VPXVR will support adjustable Ximput rumble. I have a PinSim and modified the standard build to incorporate larger rumble motors and amplify the rumble so they run at 9V. In pinball FX2VR I find it to work perfectly. It also works just as well with PinballFX3 but they don’t have VR support yet for the Williams tables.

As for the experience with the index, the resolution is much better than the Vive. The table will look much more clear. The FOV is a bit wider than the Vive but not by a huge amount. The only negatives is while the God rays are better, they are still there and the black levels are not that good since this headset uses a LCD screen.

I’m happy I bought this headset as I still think it is the best headset available right now. However, unless they somehow improve black levels on LCD screens, I don’t want to ever buy a LCD headset again. I had both a Rift and and Vive and currently also have the Quest and the index has a cleaner higher resolution picture than all of those headsets but the colors do look more washed out with poor black levels on the index.

Maybe there is a way to lower the brightness and increase the contrast...

Edited by gear323, 21 November 2019 - 05:46 AM.

[dbknightx]

Since you are thinking about getting the index...

I have the Valve index and the audio is really good. For me at least, I’m happy with hearing all the sounds from the table inside the index headset and just really hoping VPXVR will support adjustable Ximput rumble. I have a PinSim and modified the standard build to incorporate larger rumble motors and amplify the rumble so they run at 9V. In pinball FX2VR I find it to work perfectly. It also works just as well with PinballFX3 but they don’t have VR support yet for the Williams tables.

As for the experience with the index, the resolution is much better than the Vive. The table will look much more clear. The FOV is a bit wider than the Vive but not by a huge amount. The only negatives is while the God rays are better, they are still there and the black levels are not that good since this headset uses a LCD screen.

I’m happy I bought this headset as I still think it is the best headset available right now. However, unless they somehow improve black levels on LCD screens, I don’t want to ever by a LCD headset again. I had both a Rift and and Vive and currently also have the Quest and the index had a cleaner higher desolation picture than all of those headsets but the colors do look more washed out with poor black levels on the index.

Maybe there is a way to lower the brightness and increase the contrast...

Thanks for the great feedback.  Your experience with the Index mirrors many of the reviews I've read, although some seem to stop noticing the black level issue unless switching back and forth between other headsets.  Unfortunately there doesn't seem to be a perfect headset yet, but the lack of detail is my biggest issue so I think I'll be pretty happy in that respect.

 

I'm frankly not that familiar with Xinput Rumble.  Has there been any indication that this is something on the roadmap for VPXVR?  I'll check out the PinSim build in more detail, since I must have glossed over that part.

 

Thanks again!

[sniiki]

Not sure if it had been discussed already in this topic but one thing I'd like to have is possibility to tie the table position to a VR tracked controller (attach the controller to a rigid holder on the table). This way we'd have
1) table always at the same position relative to the headset as hard nudges tend to move the light VR cabinet easily.

2) probably better nudging experience compared to accelerometer, tho I don't know if it's more problem of the code vs the sensors that the nudging doesn't feel that realistic.

 

Btw I have visual nudge disabled but it's still visible when trying a desperate center hole drain save. Did I miss something or is it a bug / unfinished thing?

[WilsonB]

.

Edited by WilsonB, 10 November 2019 - 08:37 PM.

[WilsonB]

2)  Audio:  Not thrilled with the audio on my HTC Vive DAS headset and would love for at least table sounds to come from the table direction.  Has anybody given any thought about how to improve the audio in VR?  Perhaps investing in better headphones would do the trick.  Am also considering adding some audio to the pinstubby itself.

 

I was considering Index, but honestly very happy I went with Oculus Quest Instead.

 

 

Yes, I also brought audio up not long ago. For immersion the sound should seem to come from Table, the best that could be done here is a reverb effect

additionally, in future when the sound pro's figure how to add directional audio will add to effect.

Example of walking away , turning head the sound changes.

 

On Audio topic:

I use Bose QC35 (connected w/ audio to Oculus)

I noticed in audio out options, Standard 2 Channel and all the other Surround options and 7.1.

With Dolby Atmos and other surround audio technology, will this be an option today with VPX VR? Should we stick with 2 channels only?

Edited by WilsonB, 10 November 2019 - 08:42 PM.

[WilsonB]

Wilson, in the video the contrast seems or is (too) high, for instance the floor is not visible. On the HTC vive this is not the case, can you see the floor tiles properly when wearing the quest?

 

Thanks again for sharing your talents.. Appreciate it!

Playing Pinball on VR was a major driving factor for taking on this big project.. Was also considering on actual build cabinet before 5 months ago..VR is a clear better option for myself considering space, cost and endless VR possibilities.

 

Anyway, thanks for your response above. Not sure about the colors/contrast or where to change them I did want to bring down the gamma a little. The colored lights on table are a little bright. Is there options for color and contrast within VPX? If not in VPX settings, maybe it's in Steam VR settings.

[blindpeser]

OK guys, I am in again. VPVR is working for me again. I just tried to disable real time protection. This and pinaffinity makes the trick on CV for me. Wow, what a table! Runs smooth as butter now.

 

@flupper1: I just made some on yout Totan. ALL of you guys really should have a look on this. The table and the room look outstanding!

 

Unfortunately the real table doesnt like me. And your version decided to do the same. I am just really bad on it, so my joy is decreasing fast. But your work is just awesome!

 

Btw, your Diner is one of my favourites. It is just awesome. Do you plan an update, that includes the latest technologies? A real VR 50s diner that contains the pinball would be pretty neat.

 

Almost forgot. You guys need to play the new Flintstones. Amazing work here. Did anybody already put it into a VR room and a body and would like to share it? Unfortunately I do not have a lot of time these days. Thank you!

Edited by blindpeser, 10 November 2019 - 10:33 PM.

[WilsonB]

Wilson, in the video the contrast seems or is (too) high, for instance the floor is not visible. On the HTC vive this is not the case, can you see the floor tiles properly when wearing the quest?

 

Thanks for the feedback.

AC-DC VR Table also needs environment lighting up and colors turned down a little.

I researched all the different places to change brightness and contrast without success. Everything looks good outside of VPX VR, so changes need to be done within VPX.

I found this,

https://vpinball.com...nment-lighting/

but looks complicated,  like I could muck up something real quick..and still don't know how to backup configurations to fall back on.

Seems the whole environment needs a slight brightness to step up and "light up" items inside table needs to be turned down/maybe colors down slightly.

Edited by WilsonB, 11 November 2019 - 07:54 PM.

[WilsonB]

Could someone list all the known VPX VR tables available with d/l links and include which ones have rooms built in?

I have searched for flintstones without luck for example and don't know what CSI table is.

 

Thanks a million..

 

Once some BAM experts get into VR, maybe someone will create a decent Front end Table launcher that can live in Steam VR Library.

Currently launching has to be done outside VR. I click on the table file, it starts VPX VR, then I have to select table again in file manager to start it.

Anyone have a better way?

 

 

Maybe we should start a Facebook VPX VR Group page since we still don't have a designated area for VR.

 

Update:

Click here for new VPX VR group

https://www.facebook...22550378241713/

 

Cheers

Edited by WilsonB, 11 November 2019 - 07:56 PM.

[gear323]

Could someone list all the known VPX VR tables available, and include which ones have rooms built in?

 

Thanks a million..

 

Once some BAM experts get into VR, maybe someone will create a decent Front end Table launcher that can live in Steam VR Library.

Currently launching has to be done outside VR. I click on the table, it starts VPX VR, then I have to hit start again.

Anyone have a better way?

 

 

Maybe we should start a Facebook VPX VR Group page since we still don't have a designated area for VR.

 

Update:

Click here for new VPX VR group

https://www.facebook...22550378241713/

 

Cheers

 

Hey Wilson, 

 

Oculus Link is supposed to be released in the next month or so.  Virtual Desktop will then not be needed since streaming to the Quest from PC will be supported directly from Facebook.  While even that probably won't be a as good of an experience as you would get with a a VR headset that is made for the PC, that will probably be better than what you are doing now with Virtual Desktop. 

 

I wonder if that will help with the colors and contrast etc.... 

 

 

As for your question about tables released with VR rooms included, as far as I know so far it is just Addams Family, CSI, ACDC and TOTAN

Edited by gear323, 11 November 2019 - 09:43 PM.