285 replies to this topic

[BilboX]

Definitely not looking for "retro-compatibility" here Just curious about other setups.

 

Actually I just tried the default Beta settings again on my desktop (i7, 16GB, GTX770) and AFM plays really smooth with the desktop view (only very few drops below 60fps). However as soon as I change to cabinet view with the same options -> FPS drops somewhere between 40-50 and stuttering is pretty bad. So the cab view seems to be a lot more taxing.

Yeah. We provided a lot of options to stick the most to existing harware. Cab uses 2 cameras, that is why it is more expensive (I know, you want B2S support ).

My cab settings (provided as a sample in the beta) has some options disbaled, like front glass reflection or bloom. You can play with those, they are expensive. Antialiasing is costly too.

 

Maybe we can open a topic dedicated to performances reports...

[ClarkKent]

 

The performance problems are the reason why I'm not messing about with it that much. It's totally unrealistic when the ball stutters. It would really really be interesting what hardware we need for full experience!?

This is the meaning of a Beta: determine the Hardware requirement. It is now clear that your setup does not satisfy you, I get that.

The default options in the beta are mine: Geforce GTX 680, i7, 8Go. I guess it is the "medium+" configuration. Don't know what to tell you else. UP is toward future harware, not for retro-compatibility.

 

I get constant 60fps when using real fullscreen. Multiple monitors are drainig much from the performance. I wish I can use single pf monitor in fs mode for the table and 2nd/3rd monitor via dB2S.

[parabolic]

Is there a FP --> UP starter guide somewhere?

I think Chepas was working on tables for unit3d pinball  - maybe he can help?

[BigBoss]

I get constant 60fps when using real fullscreen. Multiple monitors are drainig much from the performance. I wish I can use single pf monitor in fs mode for the table and 2nd/3rd monitor via dB2S.

Why are we so insistent that db2s is the solution here? Adding another process does not sound like a performance increasing solution to me. There is nothing about fake full screen that inherently causes a loss in performance over real full screen. Unless your real full screen res is considerably lower than your desktop res.

[ClarkKent]

The backglass solution in U3D is not as good as dB2S, especially because of the variable scaling the picture is not as sharp as dB2S is able to display. And as the performance difference between fake full screen and real full screen with 1 monitor only is substantial. In VP dB2S does not influence performance at all (in exe mode).

 

I would say it would be worth trying.

What has the biggest influence on performance on U3DP? Texture rate, pixel rate, floating-point performance or something else? It would be easier to know this to get the right graphics card...

Edited by ClarkKent, 01 July 2015 - 05:37 AM.

[BilboX]

I disagree: UP3D backglass includes lighting fromthe playfield and 3D effetcs (like in Scared Stiff or backglasses with balls). And what do you mean by "scaling variable"?

 

We will know performances sinks fter the Beta, but it is sure that spreading window (as in FakeFUllScreen) over two screen ON DIFFERENT GPUs is REALLY BAD. Is is not only in UP3D.

We are stuck by th efact that unity handles only ONE rendering window by application. Another solution would be to make 2 process... too much work for nothing...

 

Pixel lights is also consuming... but damn good result, even without shadows.

 

We reviewed all "ornaments" and there is now an option which helps a lot on some tables, the "show ornaments"...

[Badfinger]

I got it working, almost full screen Windowed screen shot off my 2nd monitor below which is a portrait monitor.

 

Thought I'd put it up.

 

Just using the .exe for it and pointing at the table directly each use, doesn't keep the monitor placement, but no big deal.

 

Bad Cats I loaded next lost 15 FPSish, but still had the same settings saved, I tried AFM table again, also that 15FPS loss.

 

Nice WIP though, thanks!

 

My rig has AMD FX-8350 CPU with a Radeon HD 7950 3gig video card, running Windows 7 Ultimate.

 

This is the latest Beta, I am totally new to this program, just discovered it tonight.

 

Edited by Badfinger, 01 July 2015 - 10:52 AM.

[BilboX]

Thanks for this report. Be carefull though to hide every menudisplay (hide the main menu too: esc by default) before checking FPS...

[louizou]

I wish you would support dB2S.

 

And I noticed that you did not use the latest textures from Bad Cats. I think you are using the ones from the FP version but I made enhanced ones for the VP version in cooperation with JP.

 

dB2S is compiled with DotNet 4 , it's not compatible with our version of unity which supports 3.5 only.

Forget about it..... for the moment....

 

For the badcats textures, i had no time to change them and it's a hassle .

i tried to change ij's playfield and i was obliged to change all object's position in the .fpt,

so i've not tried with other textures 

Edited by louizou, 01 July 2015 - 05:21 PM.

[Dozer316]

Well I would just like to say a big thank you for the work you guys have put into this.   I'm sure there have been many, many nights of code staring involved .

 

On my mini cab it works very nicely, usually about 60 FPS, sometimes a little lower with the ball faces rendering lighting effects etc. but I will spend some time tuning over the weekend.

 

The ball physics are very nice.

 

Again, thanks for the work so far, it's much appreciated.

 

Dozer.

Edited by Dozer316, 01 July 2015 - 05:22 PM.

[xxTheGoDxx]

Is there a way to import textures yet?

 

Well I would just like to say a big thank you for the work you guys have put into this.   I'm sure there have been many, many nights of code staring involved .

Dito :-)

[chepas]

 

Is there a FP --> UP starter guide somewhere?

I think Chepas was working on tables for unit3d pinball  - maybe he can help?

 

 

What do you need? There is no guide, api is without summaries unless its from Unity engine, so it's trial & lots of error.

 

Dev environment with some kind of intellisense would help for scripting. VS, Mono, loads more std text editors that can do the job.

 

Some starting tips to speed up loading would be to have 2 copies of a FP table.

• Just edit one table, then when done, save this to the copy
• Open the table copy and play in FP
• In the editor delete all unused, models, sounds, etc

This way if you need to add in objects again from FP, just open the original to edit and do same process. The loading time WILL get on your tits after a while otherwise, especially making small changes and running a test, rinse.

 

Make sure when loading editor you already have a command line link or .bat file so you can automatically load it. Do that from the off. (Save time)

 

You need a script for loading the last time I checked, but I should still have a working blank script that allows you to at least have a look inside Unit3d. Ask them to provide one.

 

Reference the other tables. If you don't know any C# it may get a little confusing, but if you want to do it, persevere with it and there really isn't much you need to have a working table. (lamp,switch,sol,trough(subway))

 

Now I remember making a tool that takes input for all your switches & lamps. I will have to look. But if I remember you just type Name & number in and it generates the script code for all which is quicker than typing into VS or something. Mainly due to referencing BX class with string.

 

Be prepared to spend some time with it. I've given up again after the Paragon pleb gate. Could probably fix editing the xml but canny be arsd. Feels like grief.

Edited by chepas, 01 July 2015 - 09:53 PM.

[louizou]

 

 

Dev environment with some kind of intellisense would help for scripting. VS, Mono, loads more std text editors that can do the job.

 

 

In mono develop , create a new solution, save it near the table.

 

Right click on "References" then left click on "Edit References"

 

 

 

Check those assemblies (or other ones if you need such as system ...)

 

 

 

Now right click on the Solution name (here Scripting) then click on "Add->Add Files"

Select your script.cs file

 

 

Select Add a link to the file.... THEN .....

It's a kind of magic :-)

 

 

Here is your code completion !!

 

 

 

 

 

Have fun !!

 

 

[BigBoss]

 
We will know performances sinks fter the Beta, but it is sure that spreading window (as in FakeFUllScreen) over two screen ON DIFFERENT GPUs is REALLY BAD..

I honesty don't know why anyone would put two video cards in a cabinet anymore.

[teppotee]

Few notes about the performance in my cab after some further testing with AFM table (i5, 4GB memory, GTX 580, win 7 pro):

- "Real full screen" vs "fake full screen all" -> not much difference in my setup so the second screen actually doesn't affect that much

 

- Pixel lights has very minor effect on my system. Tried values between 10-200 and FPS difference was minimal.

 

- I have 95% constant 60FPS when I have removed all AA and reflections

 

- FPS drops and stutter occurs when

1) Lot of lighting effects - for example in AFM when the saucer target is hit and the ball flows back from under the saucer (drops about 15 FPS)

2) When nudging! Every nudge event drops about 15 FPS for 2 seconds. This is actually my main concern as I use nudging a lot and stutter on every nudge really affects the game play (and sense of realism). Applies to analogue and digital nudge. Is there a way to remove the nudge shake effect from table? (although no idea if that would help)

 

- Stuttering doesn't seem to be GPU related as GPU utilization never reaches even close to max (tried with GTX 580 and 770). And I get the same stutter when I try to run the table with lover resolution as well (tried even really low like 640x480 or so). FPS drop with this resolution when for example nudging is less severe but it still exists.

 

-CPU utilization seems to be constantly around 60-70% across all 4 cores but I never saw a 100% spike even when stuttering. (tried with real full screen on main screen and task manager on 2nd)

 

I think I have tried all the options and performance wise it comes REALLY close to being fully enjoyable. The nudge stutter is maybe the only thing holding it back for me at the moment.

 

Thanks once again and great work so far!!

 

About DOF...Repeating my earlier question: Is anyone else having the problem with (for example) AFM & INDY that the contactors are not firing? (flashers work ok). Contactors work fine with BK2000 so I don't know what's the difference.

 

 

 

 

 

[ClarkKent]

Can you post a screenshot of your settings?

[teppotee]

Can't get a screenshot now but here are my settings as far as I remember:

 

Camera: Cabinet

Display Mode: Fake Full screen (1080p)

Pixel Lights count: Around 100

Anti Aliasing: Disabled

V-Sync: ON

Playfield reflection: OFF

Front glass reflection: OFF

High Quality Lighting: OFF (I guess this does not affect anything since the reflections are off)

Ball reflection: OFF

Bloom effect: OFF

Ball Trail effect: OFF

Continuous Collision: ON

Complex Flippers: ON

DOF: ON

[BilboX]

 

 

Is there a FP --> UP starter guide somewhere?

 

Not yet. I currently am converting RIpley's Belive Or Not. When it will be finished, I'll start a new one, easier, while recording to make a serie of commented videos.

Please be patient (again, sorry). In the meantime, the bets thing to do is to read the sscripts provided with all every tables...

 

And remember, you'll have multiple solutions to one problem...

 

Also, knowing C# is of course far easier...

 

Good luck.

[teppotee]

Seems that the nudge FPS drop I reported earlier is only related to AFM. Most likely the saucer movement is the root cause(?) because the same FPS drop happens when the saucer is hit and it's animated. 

 

DOF is still giving me headache though... BK2000 works perfectly, AFM and Indy are missing contactors completely and TAF is firing right flipper contactor but not left... weird. Should this work identically with the same table configs in directoutputconfig.ini as in VP? Or are there some differences in table scripts etc.?

[arngrim]

somebody said it works with dof 1.0 mappings, not 2.0 mappings, you can check if you have exceptions in the logs while playing afm or indy?