1103 replies to this topic

[mjr]

The JP-8 (main board) connections are really easy to test - you just need an LED and nothing else.  Connect the "+" end of the LED (the long leg) to JP8 pin 18, the one marked +5V, and connect the LED "-" (short leg) to one of the other JP8 pins to test that output port.  No LED resistor is required for these ports, because they have built-in current regulation.

 

The flasher connections on JP-11 are *almost* the same, but you *DO* have to provide a resistor to test an LED with these ports.  For these, connect the LED "-" (short leg) to the JP-11 pin you want to test, connect the LED "+" (long leg) to a suitable resistor, and connect the other end of the resistor to JP11 pin 15, "+5V".  For most small 20mA LEDs, a resistor around 100 ohms should work for testing purposes, although you should look up the exact size to use in an LED calculator (such as http://led.linear1.org/1led.wiz) for an actual installation.

[kiwiBri]

Problems with Night Mode...

 

Hi MJR, 

 

so, I'm just finishing off a few things left on my Cab. I wired up a night Mode button.. (tested the button works with the input test, then assigned the port as "night mode". I also wired up a Blue LED to an output port on the Pinscape Expansion board.  Its the 16th pin, so Port 49 I believe. I tested the output port to make sure the LED lights up, and then assigned to the Night Mode Settings.

 

Now, when I switch the button  (momentary type) night mode does not start or shown as enabled with the LED. 

I can test the Night Mode from the tester for the Outputs by clicking the on screen button and I see the LED light up.. 

 

Any tips or ideas on how to get this to work?

 

thanks in advance.

[mjr]

Could you post a screen shot of the config page showing the button section and night mode section?  That might help me spot what's going on.

[kiwiBri]

Could you post a screen shot of the config page showing the button section and night mode section?  That might help me spot what's going on.

 

been away for the past few days...   here you go.. Happy July 4th!

 

I double checked.. 

 

The button works in the inputs Test mode.. I seet [Caps Lock] key fired.

The LED lights up in the output screen

 

The system doesn't change to Nightmode. 

 

I can run the nightmode.exe program and select night mode from the checkbox, and night-mode works.

 

 

 

 

Edited by kiwiBri, 05 July 2017 - 02:08 AM.

[mjr]

been away for the past few days...   here you go.. Happy July 4th!

 

And happy Canada Day to you!

 

Everything looks good in your config settings.  I assume you're on the latest version of the firmware - I did fix a bug a few versions back that had pretty similar symptoms, so if you're on an older version that might be the problem.  If you're on the latest, maybe try setting button 22 to *only* the night mode function by changing from the Caps Lock key to no key (the little slashed-O icon).  In the meantime, I'll try reproducing your configuration to see if the bug replicates for me.

[kiwiBri]

 

been away for the past few days...   here you go.. Happy July 4th!

 

And happy Canada Day to you!

 

Everything looks good in your config settings.  I assume you're on the latest version of the firmware - I did fix a bug a few versions back that had pretty similar symptoms, so if you're on an older version that might be the problem.  If you're on the latest, maybe try setting button 22 to *only* the night mode function by changing from the Caps Lock key to no key (the little slashed-O icon).  In the meantime, I'll try reproducing your configuration to see if the bug replicates for me.

 

 

thanks

 

I should be on the latest firmware. I'll double check. 

I initially set it up as "no key" when following the instructions for setting it up but it didn't seem to work. I assigned a key to it test if input was happening from the button. Maybe I'll assign a visible character key to it and fire up notepad and see if the keystroke is being sent as well. I have only been testing in the pinscape tester.

 

btw - Everything else seems to be working well with the Pinscape board.

[mjr]

I assigned a key to it test if input was happening from the button.

 

That's certainly a worthwhile sanity check.  You can also see the physical button status in the button tester window even without a key assigned - the displayed status for the button should change to ON whenever the button is being pressed.

[kiwiBri]

 

I assigned a key to it test if input was happening from the button.

 

That's certainly a worthwhile sanity check.  You can also see the physical button status in the button tester window even without a key assigned - the displayed status for the button should change to ON whenever the button is being pressed.

 

 

 

I am using the updated firmware from May 12, 2017.

 

Ok, I have found something strange happening.. 

 

I have tested outputs #47,#48, #49  all work (by using the test screen and a LED wired up to it.) 

When I assign any of these ports to the LED indicator light for the Night Mode, and reprogram the pinscape board, I find that the output will now NOT work. I then can change to another port, and then try again and the newly assigned port wont work. The one from before is now working.

 

I turned off the output LED indicator and still had no luck with night more being turned on. 

 

 

I also changed the [CAPS Lock] key to the letter "H"  to double check that it was being sent, and confirmed with Notepad.

 

B.

Edited by kiwiBri, 06 July 2017 - 04:21 AM.

[mjr]

When I assign any of these ports to the LED indicator light for the Night Mode, and reprogram the pinscape board, I find that the output will now NOT work. I then can change to another port, and then try again and the newly assigned port wont work. The one from before is now working.

 

That much is normal.  The output that's set as the night mode indicator is exclusively used for that function, so it overrides any attempt to control the output from the PC.  Any commands to that port from DOF or the config tool are ignored, because the output is simply off when night mode is off and on when night mode is on.

[kiwiBri]

 

When I assign any of these ports to the LED indicator light for the Night Mode, and reprogram the pinscape board, I find that the output will now NOT work. I then can change to another port, and then try again and the newly assigned port wont work. The one from before is now working.

 

That much is normal.  The output that's set as the night mode indicator is exclusively used for that function, so it overrides any attempt to control the output from the PC.  Any commands to that port from DOF or the config tool are ignored, because the output is simply off when night mode is off and on when night mode is on.

 

 

Ah, I see. So that's good news then its working as normal. 

 

So then I still have the issue when I switch on night mode , it doesnt seem to fire and LED is not turned on or mode is set. I assume I can try to turn it on, then open the Nightmode.exe to see if the checkbox has been set?

 

talking of EXE's, is there anything extra like registry settings or exe's that need to be unblocked from Windows ? (windows 10)

 

Some additional information. The wiring for the Night mode is just like the other buttons in the cab. The GND for all buttons are wired to the same common wire. 

I was thinking perhaps the config entries were not being saved correectly to where its supposed to be stored? Does something need to be give access rights under Windows10?

Edited by kiwiBri, 06 July 2017 - 07:05 PM.

[mjr]

I gave it a try on my setup and it seems to be working fine.  Which is kind of unfortunate, because it means that whatever is going on with your setup isn't something obvious that I can reproduce - it must be something special about your setup.

 

Perhaps you could try simplifying your setup to isolate things a little more.  Try removing the key assignment as before, and remove the output port - set the indicator lamp output port to 0 in the night mode section in the settings page.

 

 

 

I assume I can try to turn it on, then open the Nightmode.exe to see if the checkbox has been set?

 

You can even just leave the NightMode.exe program running and monitor the status that way.  It updates every couple of seconds and displays the current device status in the checkbox.  There can be a slight delay because of the timing of the update cycle, but if you wait a few seconds after pressing the button it should eventually reflect the current status.

 

The better option is to use the config tool itself, with the Outputs Tester window open.  The Night Mode button in the lower right turns dark blue when night mode is in effect.  That updates almost immediately.

 

 

talking of EXE's, is there anything extra like registry settings or exe's that need to be unblocked from Windows ? (windows 10)

 

Nope, there shouldn't be anything like that.  If you can launch the program, everything is fine on the Windows side.  And nothing on the Windows side is even involved in controlling night mode with the button - that's entirely on the KL25Z.

 

 

I was thinking perhaps the config entries were not being saved correectly to where its supposed to be stored? Does something need to be give access rights under Windows10?

 

The settings are stored on the KL25Z itself.  The settings that appear in the Settings window in the config tool are loaded across the wire from the KL25Z, so whatever you see there when you first bring up that window is what's actually programmed on the KL25Z.

 

 

The wiring for the Night mode is just like the other buttons in the cab. The GND for all buttons are wired to the same common wire. 

 

That's correct.

 

You are using an ordinary momentary pushbutton, right?  Exactly what kind of button are you using?  I don't think that's the issue, since you've already said the physical button is testing okay, but I just want to make sure I'm not making any false assumptions about your setup.

[kiwiBri]

Hi MRJ,

 

I'll follow your suggestions.. I was just on the cabinet a few mins ago  mounting  some cabinet stuff (addressable LEDs) and went to test them and also to remove the assigned character for the Night mode (Letter "H")

 

I Turned Night mode on from the .exe

 

When I fired up PinballX and used the menus to test the LEDs I noticed that the flipper solenoids wire fire intermittently when they should be off due to Night Mode.. While testing up and down in pinballx and getting the LEDs to fire fine, I then saw my screen rotate 90 degrees. This then happened again and again a few seconds later..  then I remembered maybe the letter "H" which is the Keyboard char I assigned in the config, for Night Mode testing must be being sent to the system causing it to rotate!  lol!  I then exited out of pInball X and removed that character. Reprogrammed the pinscape, double checked NightMode.exe and when back into PinballX.  The screen didnt rotate this time, but I still get intermittant solenoids firing. 

 

Previously I have set Nightmode from the Button in the config utility and its changed colour, but the LED never lit up. I'll do some more testing again .

 

BTW, I have set the Nightmode in the .exe then exited, then come back to run it again and to see if the check box is still checked which it is. 

 

oh , yes regular pushbutton. I am confident its not the button as it would fire even if touching the bare wire to GND to fire the switch

 

 

UPDATE: 

 

I just tested again, and I think there's something screwy going on in "Night mode". With the NightMode.exe running, and the box checked,  I started pinballX and played a game (Diner) and I heard Solenoids fire, then I "Alt-Tab" on the keybaord and saw that the checkbox was now checked. I played some more then kept the NightMode.exe on topmost screen and then saw the checkbox dissappear after a time, then get enabled after a time. Almost very cyclic!   I will turn off the "Enable Night Mode button" in the configuration see how it behaves. A week or two ago before I looked into using a button to control NIght Mode, the Exe worked fine to enable and disable the toys as expected.

Edited by kiwiBri, 07 July 2017 - 12:34 AM.

[mjr]

I should make sure we're really talking about the same thing here.  When you're testing night mode, are you going by the indicator in the Output Test window, or are you talking entirely about weird intermittent random solenoid firing?  If it's the latter, this might be something like electrical interference causing the random firing.  If you could first confirm whether or not the indicator button in the Output Test window is working:

 

- Open the Output Test window

- Push your physical cabinet night mode button

- Does the indicator in the Output Test window change color?

- Push the cabinet button again

- Does the indicator change back?

[kiwiBri]

I should make sure we're really talking about the same thing here.  When you're testing night mode, are you going by the indicator in the Output Test window, or are you talking entirely about weird intermittent random solenoid firing?  If it's the latter, this might be something like electrical interference causing the random firing.  If you could first confirm whether or not the indicator button in the Output Test window is working:

 

- Open the Output Test window

- Push your physical cabinet night mode button

- Does the indicator in the Output Test window change color?

- Push the cabinet button again

- Does the indicator change back?

 

Hi MJR, I don't believe its electrical interference. Solendoids fire when they are supposed to (game play or menu selection Left/Right in PinballX)  It was just that I noticed that the NightMode.exe checkbox was being checked and unchecked by itself. 

 

If I followup your test above, and use the button, the indicator in the Output Test Window does not change colour. It doesn't seem to turn on.  (Dark Blue)

[mjr]

Hi MJR, I don't believe its electrical interference. Solendoids fire when they are supposed to (game play or menu selection Left/Right in PinballX)  It was just that I noticed that the NightMode.exe checkbox was being checked and unchecked by itself. 

 

If I followup your test above, and use the button, the indicator in the Output Test Window does not change colour. It doesn't seem to turn on.  (Dark Blue)

 

Okay, that's at least what I was surmising originally (i.e., that it's a simple matter of the button failing to toggle night mode).

 

I'm trying to figure out what's different about your setup from what I'm testing, since it seems to be working right for me.  Try to simplify things as much as possible to isolate just this one thing.  Disable the indicator lamp output if you haven't tried that yet.  You should probably also try shutting down all other software on the Windows side, to rule out software interference: kill PinballX, PinVol, VP, DMD software, etc.

[kiwiBri]

 

Okay, that's at least what I was surmising originally (i.e., that it's a simple matter of the button failing to toggle night mode).

 

I'm trying to figure out what's different about your setup from what I'm testing, since it seems to be working right for me.  Try to simplify things as much as possible to isolate just this one thing.  Disable the indicator lamp output if you haven't tried that yet.  You should probably also try shutting down all other software on the Windows side, to rule out software interference: kill PinballX, PinVol, VP, DMD software

 

 

Right, so after many test scenarios, heres what I found:

 

If I turn off the Pinscape After Dark (Set Button Input = 0) and then Use the NightMode Exe to set or unset the NightMode status, everything works great!  I turned on Night Mode , started PinballX and played Diner without any strange events happening.  All as designed

I turn off Night Mode, and started PinballX and the events all are firing as expected in PinballX and in game play. I tested in 2 tables (Diner/TZ) and everything fired perfectly. No strange or random firing of solenoids etc. I am 100% sure there is no electrical interference in this case.

 

Now, it looks like if I enable the Pinscape After Dark by setting a Button Input = xx  then this is where it looks like the pinscape is sending out random signals/keystrokes for some reason...? Seems bizzare.

 

One last test, I will wire the button to a differnt input and see if I get the same issues. 

 

UPDATE: Changed the input port to #24, tested to ensure port is being read ok, then assigned to the port to the Night Mode,  got the same result. Night mode fails to switch on.   All tests done with Windows 10 boot up, and not running any table's or other software. Just the pinscape configuration.exe

Not sure if it matters, but I have both USB cables plugged into the KL25Z board, and no errors occur at all during programming/reboot. 

Edited by kiwiBri, 07 July 2017 - 03:25 AM.

[kiwiBri]

Another Update:

 

Using the Software button in the Configuration utility (test outputs) I am able to click that button and Turn on the Output LED and night mode is engaged . Clicking again turns it off.  

 

I also tried my tests by changing the type of switch to On/Off and that didn't work either.  I have switched it back to Momentary. 

 

 

I think the issue is that the Pinscape board does not  "see" the switch input firing to turn on Night Mode.   

 

Is it worth trying to reflash the firmware ?

 

 

One thing to note is that although I have the RGBs/Strobe wiring connected to the boards, I don't have the actual devices (The RGBs) connected, as the flasher bar is removed so I can access the inside of the cab. I don't see how this would affect things.

[mjr]

Is it worth trying to reflash the firmware ?

 

It could be worth a try, if for no other reason than to make absolutely sure you have the latest version installed.  (If you're thinking in terms of "the firmware got corrupted" or something like that, though, I'd say the probability is almost exactly zero - I've never seen happen with these boards, and even if it did, the symptom would be a complete brick, not one very specific problem with everything else working).  Download the "Latest Release" firmware from http://mjrnet.org/pi.../swversions.php to your PC, then use "Update" in the config tool to install the file you downloaded.

 

The only other thing I can think to try is to revert to a "factory configuration" in case the problem is an interaction between settings.  Use the backup/restore button in the config tool to save your current config to a file, then use the "Set up a new KL25Z" button on the main page in the config tool to do a fresh install of the firmware (using a copy you manually downloaded from the site above).  Go to the settings pages and click the Expansion Boards button, then set the Night Mode button again.  Leave everything else with the defaults and click Program KL25Z.  

[kiwiBri]

 

Is it worth trying to reflash the firmware ?

 

It could be worth a try, if for no other reason than to make absolutely sure you have the latest version installed.  (If you're thinking in terms of "the firmware got corrupted" or something like that, though, I'd say the probability is almost exactly zero - I've never seen happen with these boards, and even if it did, the symptom would be a complete brick, not one very specific problem with everything else working).  Download the "Latest Release" firmware from http://mjrnet.org/pi.../swversions.php to your PC, then use "Update" in the config tool to install the file you downloaded.

 

The only other thing I can think to try is to revert to a "factory configuration" in case the problem is an interaction between settings.  Use the backup/restore button in the config tool to save your current config to a file, then use the "Set up a new KL25Z" button on the main page in the config tool to do a fresh install of the firmware (using a copy you manually downloaded from the site above).  Go to the settings pages and click the Expansion Boards button, then set the Night Mode button again.  Leave everything else with the defaults and click Program KL25Z.  

 

 

 

Good idea. I'll take a backup and do a reflash of the firmware and just set up the night mode button. ( I had the same thoughts as you thinking it would just not work if corrupted) 

Going to have to wait until tomorrow as I have a work function this evening. 

[kiwiBri]

SUCCESS!

 

MJR, 

 

I tried your suggestion. Backed up my configuration and then reflashed firmware and set the Pinscape up as a new one. 

 

I assigned the ports for the Night Mode and the LED light, and it worked ! Hooray!

 

I went back and reloaded my original configuration and it was back like before.   Repeated the above procedure and then I figured I'd just reassign the keys. Well Guess what? I realised something strange had happened in the original setup. My output ports for the solenoids are assigned to ports #34 onwards!? You can see this in the previous images I posted earlier.  When I first set up the outputs, I just went through the Output Tester trying each one until I found where the first solenoid fired. I just thought it was the way it worked as everything seemed to work fine. I had a matching DOF setup that worked as well. The RGB outputs were #1 to #15, with the strobe being #16  , then Solenoids (from the Power Board) on #34 onwards.

 

Well , I remapped everything, and the output ports for the solenoids are from port  #18 onwards. Redid the DOF and everything is now working as expected with the Night Mode Button switching things on and off correctly!!

 

So, to sum up, somehow,  when I initially setup pinscape in the configuration the ports being mapped to were about 16 ports higher than they should have been, starting at #34 for the first solenoid.  I wonder if it thought it detected 2 external Pinscape Power boards or something and got the port numbering mixed up?

 

 

It seems by reflashing the firmware and resetting, it detected everything correctly and is working fine.

 

Well, this is good news, I can now wire up the button as planned (probably mount inside the coin door on a spare bracket/button I salvaged from a real cab). Pretty happy now that things are on track again. 

Edited by kiwiBri, 08 July 2017 - 01:49 PM.