1002 replies to this topic

[BigBoss]

Hey Slashbot, I'm happy to swap all the ones I've done privately with you. The cftbl is in my broken folder for fixkng after I get through the rest. I have 102 in my working physmod folder. The cftbl problem seemed worse then a broken kicker to me. The script seemed to have a destroyball in it. I didn't get further and planned to come back to it.

[BuckoBundy]

Anyone knows howto fix the strenght of the kicker (movie right of the middle ramp)in creatures of the black lagoon?
 

line 97, in the bsSubway routine reads like:

.KickZ = 90

 

Change it to 91 and it works.

This is some bug as described by Mukuste:

 

It seems to work fine when setting inclination (the 3rd parameter to Kick) to something close to 90 degrees, but not quite, e.g.:

 	Kicker2.Kick 0,40,89.5

It seems when the angle is very close to 90°, the ball gets caught in the kicker immediately again. I'll have a look at it when I have time.

 

[mukuste]

Well I've just had a day rinsing loads of well-maintained machines, and with that fresh in my mind I've hopped on the physmod to compare... and it still rocks. Totally impressed Pretty much 95% of the way there in terms of what I feel is that pinball vibe that I so desperately crave! That last 5% is kind of wishy-washy stuff that I'm sure will be addressed as progress is made, and most of that will be when dynamic lighting is added and I can crank the ambient lighting down and play by the glow of the lamps

 

These are just some general observations rather than demands for improvements!

* The scale of the ball feels not quite... right? Maybe fractionally too small? Possibly an optical illusion or something that'll be fixed with the 3D ball mesh that's in progress, or I'm mad, OR It's the lack of reflections on the ball that makes it look unusual? (Maybe there could be an option in the future to render things with the ball proportions as the scale reference, if that makes any sense at all?)

* Holes/kickers/stuff going under the table - the ball will just slot right in on VP, never to be rejected, which does not match my experience on the real thing I don't know if these actually have any depth on VP, but I'm assuming not at the moment?

* Bounciness of ball on inlane/outlane posts - currently a bit flat in VP, not the nail-biting bouncefest of the real thing. I'm guessing this'll be tunable with the elasticity values on objects in the near future though!

 

Other than that though, the new physics look like they're gonna scratch an itch that commerical pinball games can't, and I'm pretty convinced that a virtual cab build is a worthwhile thing to do once VP10 is properly underway! Hooray for advanced maths simulations!

 

Thanks for the detailed feedback, and very happy to hear that the new physics hold up well in direct comparison with the real thing!

 

As to your points:

 

1. It does seem that the ball feels a bit too small compared to a real pinball table. I'm not sure what's the cause, perhaps the sprite ball is simply rendered a bit too small. As far as the physics are concerned, as long as the table respects the VP dimensions of 50 units = 1 1/16th inch (ball diameter), everything should work fine.

 

2. Yes, the holes have quite simplistic logic for capturing the ball. I haven't touched that code much at all so far. However, what I want to make possible in VP10 is to have true holes in the playfield (as also suggested by Unclewilly in the ideas thread).

 

3. That's simply the way current VP tables are tuned, I definitely agree that it feels too flat. The main problem here is that, if you crank up the elasticity too high, fast balls go completely crazy. However, with the new elasticity model which I already introduced to the flippers and will implement for all rubber objects in the future, it will be possible to specify that elasticity should fall off at higher velocities. This will allow the proper bounciness at lower velocities.

[BuckoBundy]

To fix the (almost) impossible whirlpool shot in Whitewater; search for 'sw48_Hit' and comment out the two lines that mess with the ball velocity.

 

A lot of tables have these 'helper' routines and I found you can get rid of most of them. Trial and error though.

[mukuste]

Holy crap, great find! I wouldn't have even thought of checking the script for that.

[ClarkKent]

To fix the (almost) impossible whirlpool shot in Whitewater; search for 'sw48_Hit' and comment out the two lines that mess with the ball velocity.

 

A lot of tables have these 'helper' routines and I found you can get rid of most of them. Trial and error though.

I wonder why those "helper" routines influences the new physics!?

 

Edit: The fix really helps - but now the whirlpool ramp shows the same bug as e.g. the delta quadrant ramp in STTNG or the ramp in AFM: Sometimes the ball does not follow the direction of the ramp but disappears or falls off the ramp at some point. This happened several times when testing White Water with the new fix...

 

I really wonder what causes this weird behavior on ramps!?

Edited by ClarkKent, 20 April 2014 - 09:54 PM.

[unclewilly]

Usually helper routines don't change the physics but change the velocity of the ball. It must have been a case where jo used a trigger to slow the ball down so it wouldn't fly off the ramp.
With the new physics the ball seems to have more weight so it wouldn't allow the ball to make the ramp

[mukuste]

 

To fix the (almost) impossible whirlpool shot in Whitewater; search for 'sw48_Hit' and comment out the two lines that mess with the ball velocity.

 

A lot of tables have these 'helper' routines and I found you can get rid of most of them. Trial and error though.

I wonder why those "helper" routines influences the new physics!?

 

Edit: The fix really helps - but now the whirlpool ramp shows the same bug as e.g. the delta quadrant ramp in STTNG or the ramp in AFM: Sometimes the ball does not follow the direction of the ramp but disappears or falls off the ramp at some point. This happened several times when testing White Water with the new fix...

 

I really wonder what causes this weird behavior on ramps!?

 

Why shouldn't the script influence the physics? It forcibly sets the ball velocity to a different value, that's a pretty drastic interference with the physics engine.

 

These ramp fall-throughs happen, I think, when there are two ramps being joined together, it seems to happen that there can be a slight gap between them. As mentioned before: you can help a lot by extracting such cases into separate test tables, it makes debugging them much faster.

[BigBoss]

 

Anyone knows howto fix the strenght of the kicker (movie right of the middle ramp)in creatures of the black lagoon?
 

line 97, in the bsSubway routine reads like:
.KickZ = 90
 
Change it to 91 and it works.
This is some bug as described by Mukuste:
 

It seems to work fine when setting inclination (the 3rd parameter to Kick) to something close to 90 degrees, but not quite, e.g.:

Kicker2.Kick 0,40,89.5

It seems when the angle is very close to 90°, the ball gets caught in the kicker immediately again. I'll have a look at it when I have time.
 

 

Has anyone looked into why shooting the right saucer basically does nothing but has the ball sit there? Edit: was a table bug I think. Tried another version and seems ok.
 
 

 

To fix the (almost) impossible whirlpool shot in Whitewater; search for 'sw48_Hit' and comment out the two lines that mess with the ball velocity.
 
A lot of tables have these 'helper' routines and I found you can get rid of most of them. Trial and error though.

I wonder why those "helper" routines influences the new physics!?
 
Edit: The fix really helps - but now the whirlpool ramp shows the same bug as e.g. the delta quadrant ramp in STTNG or the ramp in AFM: Sometimes the ball does not follow the direction of the ramp but disappears or falls off the ramp at some point. This happened several times when testing White Water with the new fix...
 
I really wonder what causes this weird behavior on ramps!?
 

Im finding this to be ok with the upper flipper set at 1.0 / 2400

Edited by BigBoss, 21 April 2014 - 02:27 AM.

[JavaJack]

Are there any YouTube videos demonstrating physmod? I was naturally curious based on the good feedback in this thread, but didn't have time to install it locally. I did a quick search on YouTube for "vp physmod" and "visual pinball physmod" and didn't see anything (yet).

[BigBoss]

Are there any YouTube videos demonstrating physmod? I was naturally curious based on the good feedback in this thread, but didn't have time to install it locally. I did a quick search on YouTube for "vp physmod" and "visual pinball physmod" and didn't see anything (yet).

You should try it. With the physmod, I think VP moved from totally unplayable to the best physics of any video pinball I've seen, including the awesome pinball fx2.

[Gamester]

Between the improvements expected in VP10 and the promise of Unit3D pinball, which I believe has the potential to even surpass these physics, virtual pinball has a very bright future!  I was starting to question the value proposition of building my cabinet last year.  I've just been disappointed with the visual fidelity and physics of both FP and VP to this point.  That's finally all starting to change and I'm feeling a lot better about my investment.    Many thanks to all that are putting so much effort into bringing these new sims to reality!

[mukuste]

Between the improvements expected in VP10 and the promise of Unit3D pinball, which I believe has the potential to even surpass these physics, virtual pinball has a very bright future!  I was starting to question the value proposition of building my cabinet last year.  I've just been disappointed with the visual fidelity and physics of both FP and VP to this point.  That's finally all starting to change and I'm feeling a lot better about my investment.    Many thanks to all that are putting so much effort into bringing these new sims to reality!

 

In what area do you see Unit3D physics as being even better? I'm curious what can be improved.

[slashbot]

I exchanged some physicmod tables with bigboss and all the tables i load dont start. No error message I got the roms so thats not the problem checked the ntfs permissions all seems ok. Tried to run as administrator Tried to save the table with another name Uac is disabled Tried different vp versions tables are loading in vp921 but not in physicsmod2 Anyone could help? Edit: Tested on my 2th pc and there it works, so it must be something non vp releated. Ill let you know if i figured it out what the problem. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

Edited by slashbot, 21 April 2014 - 10:35 AM.

[BuckoBundy]

The weird behaviour on the Delta Quadrant ramp in STTNG seems to be caused by the diverter on top of the ramp. It's a tiny flipper really and when it should divert the ball to the wire ramp, it often whacks the ball seriously hard and it can end up anywhere.

It is easy to correct:

the name is"TopDiverter".

change Mass to "1".

change Strength to "2500".

 

That worked fine in the few test games I played. YMMV

[ClarkKent]

The weird behaviour on the Delta Quadrant ramp in STTNG seems to be caused by the diverter on top of the ramp. It's a tiny flipper really and when it should divert the ball to the wire ramp, it often whacks the ball seriously hard and it can end up anywhere.

It is easy to correct:

the name is"TopDiverter".

change Mass to "1".

change Strength to "2500".

 

That worked fine in the few test games I played. YMMV

GREAT! You are a really really great "finder" of bugs! Please continue!

[slashbot]

Sorry for this dumb question
I cannot select top topdivert from select the list is to big and goed up to my second monitor to to R and cannot scroll further then that.

Tried to seach topdivert from the tableeditor but cant find it.

Then i tried to select topdivert from edit select element but i get a mss 'the current selection contains multiple object types,select either a single or a group of objects of the same type'

Any tips welcome

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

[lizard]

Then i tried to select topdivert from edit select element but i get a mss 'the current selection contains multiple object types,select either a single or a group of objects of the same type'

Any tips welcome

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

I have had this happen when I already had an object selected when using the edit select element. Solution is to make sure to have nothing selected before hand.

[slashbot]

Ok i fixed stttn and cftbl thnx for these fixes.

I found another problem in black rose hires maybe someone can help?
When i shoot the left ramp the ball is like blocked in the middle and does not go further.



Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

[BigBoss]

Ok i fixed stttn and cftbl thnx for these fixes.

I found another problem in black rose hires maybe someone can help?
When i shoot the left ramp the ball is like blocked in the middle and does not go further.



 

I cannot reproduce this. My flipper settings are 1.0/2400 on this table.