23 replies to this topic

[rooter]

I finally got my LED-Wiz and Cree LEDs all wired up and in the cab, and man, they look beautiful!

However, my "FPS" are now terrible. My favorite table at the moment is Congo. I was getting 400fps before I added the LED-Wiz and now I am only getting 100fps after. Does anyone know what is causing this and have a workaround? My searches only show that people beefed up their processor and switched from XP to Windows 7. Even with major upgrades to my system, it isn't going to be 400% faster and switching to Windows 7 is going to make everything else run worse. There must be another way.


Edit: Problem solved. Regenerated .ini and chose "non pwm flasher color config" mode.

Edited by rootter, 07 June 2012 - 03:15 AM.

[Dazz]

It requires a pretty beefy machine to run the LED-Wiz scripts...

[rooter]

It requires a pretty beefy machine to run the LED-Wiz scripts...

I have no problem with slow down on my Mame cabinet and LED Wiz. I have since narrowed down the problem to the LED Wiz and animated back glasses running at the same time. This seems like a problem that someone would have solved by now. When the flashers aren't going off, the game doesn't lag that badly. Once things start blinking, everything goes to a crawl.

[numiah]

It requires a pretty beefy machine to run the LED-Wiz scripts...

Sorry Dazz, I have to disagree with you on this one.
My mediocre system runs things fine with the Led Wiz and 31 ports in use.
UVP is another story though.

One thing I've learned there is also a luck factor involved for things to run smooth.
I'm sure my old Core2Duo will beat some of the stronger builds with i7's and 8Gb of memory.

[rooter]

It requires a pretty beefy machine to run the LED-Wiz scripts...

Sorry Dazz, I have to disagree with you on this one.
My mediocre system runs things fine with the Led Wiz and 31 ports in use.
UVP is another story though.

One thing I've learned there is also a luck factor involved for things to run smooth.
I'm sure my old Core2Duo will beat some of the stronger builds with i7's and 8Gb of memory.

Okay, I have been using the B2S tables instead of the UPV ones and my FPS are back! 600-800 on some tables. However, I still get a quarter second of lag when some flashes go off. It's especially annoying when lights flash because the slingshots were hit. I think it is only some of the flashes and I'm not sure which ones. It is hard to see the ball and the flashers at the same time. Anyone seen/fixed that problem?

[Zablon]

Once again...power isn't the issue. Bad coding is. Too many timings relying on other timings. Power isn't a surefire way to fix it.

[rooter]

Once again...power isn't the issue. Bad coding is. Too many timings relying on other timings. Power isn't a surefire way to fix it.

Absolutely right. This is something that feels like it can definitely be fixed via software. The problem is so obvious on my machine. I am wondering if it is equally bad for others. I can't see how people would have put up with it for so long. Tonight I was playing the new B2S STTNG. The game is playable, but every ball I lost was due to a quick lag at the wrong time.

[rosve]

Once again...power isn't the issue. Bad coding is. Too many timings relying on other timings. Power isn't a surefire way to fix it.

Absolutely right. This is something that feels like it can definitely be fixed via software. The problem is so obvious on my machine. I am wondering if it is equally bad for others. I can't see how people would have put up with it for so long. Tonight I was playing the new B2S STTNG. The game is playable, but every ball I lost was due to a quick lag at the wrong time.

I have a very similar PC as Numiah, I belive. ( Pentium 5400 Dual Core and GT220 graphics. DDR2 ram)
I have no stutter at all on any of the B2S tables. Even most UVPs are workin fine.

If the stutter comes when LedWiz is activated then the issue is probably with the LedWiz software that seems to need a massive amount of CPU time to set a couple of outputs.

It can also be that VP isn't able run to it's full potential on the newer HyperThreaded CPUs as it is really a single core process (doesn't go well with HT).

Has anyone tried with Hyper-Threading disabled on their I7 ?

edit,
Here is how to disable HT,
1. Start -> Run -> type MSCONFIG
2. Choose the BOOT tab
3. Click ADVANCED OPTIONS
4. Click the box next to number of processors
5. Select 2 from the drop down list.
6. Select Ok
7. Choose EXIT AND RESTART

Edited by rosve, 02 June 2012 - 09:12 AM.

[rooter]

Once again...power isn't the issue. Bad coding is. Too many timings relying on other timings. Power isn't a surefire way to fix it.

Absolutely right. This is something that feels like it can definitely be fixed via software. The problem is so obvious on my machine. I am wondering if it is equally bad for others. I can't see how people would have put up with it for so long. Tonight I was playing the new B2S STTNG. The game is playable, but every ball I lost was due to a quick lag at the wrong time.

I have a very similar PC as Numiah, I belive. ( Pentium 5400 Dual Core and GT220 graphics. DDR2 ram)
I have no stutter at all on any of the B2S tables. Even most UVPs are workin fine.

If the stutter comes when LedWiz is activated then the issue is probably with the LedWiz software that seems to need a massive amount of CPU time to set a couple of outputs.

It can also be that VP isn't able run to it's full potential on the newer HyperThreaded CPUs as it is really a single core process (doesn't go well with HT).

Has anyone tried with Hyper-Threading disabled on their I7 ?

edit,
Here is how to disable HT,
1. Start -> Run -> type MSCONFIG
2. Choose the BOOT tab
3. Click ADVANCED OPTIONS
4. Click the box next to number of processors
5. Select 2 from the drop down list.
6. Select Ok
7. Choose EXIT AND RESTART

I'm telling you, I dont think it is the CPU, something is wrong somewhere in software. There is no huge increase in load when the ledwiz is activated. It feels like the game is paused, waiting for the blink timer to finish. I'm going to try and set up vp on my MAME, a much less powerful machine, that runs the ledwiz with no lag whatsoever with anything I have tried.

[rosve]

Once again...power isn't the issue. Bad coding is. Too many timings relying on other timings. Power isn't a surefire way to fix it.

Absolutely right. This is something that feels like it can definitely be fixed via software. The problem is so obvious on my machine. I am wondering if it is equally bad for others. I can't see how people would have put up with it for so long. Tonight I was playing the new B2S STTNG. The game is playable, but every ball I lost was due to a quick lag at the wrong time.

I have a very similar PC as Numiah, I belive. ( Pentium 5400 Dual Core and GT220 graphics. DDR2 ram)
I have no stutter at all on any of the B2S tables. Even most UVPs are workin fine.

If the stutter comes when LedWiz is activated then the issue is probably with the LedWiz software that seems to need a massive amount of CPU time to set a couple of outputs.

It can also be that VP isn't able run to it's full potential on the newer HyperThreaded CPUs as it is really a single core process (doesn't go well with HT).

Has anyone tried with Hyper-Threading disabled on their I7 ?

edit,
Here is how to disable HT,
1. Start -> Run -> type MSCONFIG
2. Choose the BOOT tab
3. Click ADVANCED OPTIONS
4. Click the box next to number of processors
5. Select 2 from the drop down list.
6. Select Ok
7. Choose EXIT AND RESTART

I'm telling you, I dont think it is the CPU, something is wrong somewhere in software. There is no huge increase in load when the ledwiz is activated. It feels like the game is paused, waiting for the blink timer to finish. I'm going to try and set up vp on my MAME, a much less powerful machine, that runs the ledwiz with no lag whatsoever with anything I have tried.

Well, instead of "think it isn't the cpu", why not make sure and try with HT off?
It's a very simple test and you can easily set HT on again if it didn't work.

[bent98]

Once again...power isn't the issue. Bad coding is. Too many timings relying on other timings. Power isn't a surefire way to fix it.

Absolutely right. This is something that feels like it can definitely be fixed via software. The problem is so obvious on my machine. I am wondering if it is equally bad for others. I can't see how people would have put up with it for so long. Tonight I was playing the new B2S STTNG. The game is playable, but every ball I lost was due to a quick lag at the wrong time.

I have a very similar PC as Numiah, I belive. ( Pentium 5400 Dual Core and GT220 graphics. DDR2 ram)
I have no stutter at all on any of the B2S tables. Even most UVPs are workin fine.

If the stutter comes when LedWiz is activated then the issue is probably with the LedWiz software that seems to need a massive amount of CPU time to set a couple of outputs.

It can also be that VP isn't able run to it's full potential on the newer HyperThreaded CPUs as it is really a single core process (doesn't go well with HT).

Has anyone tried with Hyper-Threading disabled on their I7 ?

edit,
Here is how to disable HT,
1. Start -> Run -> type MSCONFIG
2. Choose the BOOT tab
3. Click ADVANCED OPTIONS
4. Click the box next to number of processors
5. Select 2 from the drop down list.
6. Select Ok
7. Choose EXIT AND RESTART

I'm telling you, I dont think it is the CPU, something is wrong somewhere in software. There is no huge increase in load when the ledwiz is activated. It feels like the game is paused, waiting for the blink timer to finish. I'm going to try and set up vp on my MAME, a much less powerful machine, that runs the ledwiz with no lag whatsoever with anything I have tried.

Well, instead of "think it isn't the cpu", why not make sure and try with HT off?
It's a very simple test and you can easily set HT on again if it didn't work.

you can also disable HT in the bios.

[russdx]

if this is the same issue as they had over at hyperspin, it can be CORRECTED all the ledwiz serial driver code needs to be removed from the vp scripts (SLOW / not threaded) and moved into the actual pinmame.dll where it can be threaded correctly.

it doesn't matter how many cores your cpu has if vp script does not support threading it will wait while the ledwiz does it serial crap

move all that code into the pinmame.dll that does support threading and the problem will be solved.





the pindmd is proof of this, when i had the FTDI code NOT running in a thread it caused the tables to lag and run crap. the second i threaded it, it did not effect the tables at all and they run perfect!!

Edited by russdx, 02 June 2012 - 04:31 PM.

[rooter]

if this is the same issue as they had over at hyperspin, it can be CORRECTED all the ledwiz serial driver code needs to be removed from the vp scripts (SLOW / not threaded) and moved into the actual pinmame.dll where it can be threaded correctly.

it doesn't matter how many cores your cpu has if vp script does not support threading it will wait while the ledwiz does it serial crap

move all that code into the pinmame.dll that does support threading and the problem will be solved.

the pindmd is proof of this, when i had the FTDI code NOT running in a thread it caused the tables to lag and run crap. the second i threaded it, it did not effect the tables at all and they run perfect!!

I'm not familiar with the code yet, how difficult would this be to accomplish? Did you check your FTDI code into an official subversion branch so that all future versions of VP will have the code in it and you don't need to make a custom build for everyone every time there is a new version?

[russdx]

no my FTDI is not in the official version as its tailed for just the pinDMD

far as im aware these led-wiz boards dont use FTDI they use a cyprus chip? which would need different integration headers/code. but the principle is the same.

it needs to be moved into the pinmame.dll
or talk to another com object running the led-wip serial code

basically need to remove the led-wiz code from the vb scripts and put them in a standalone .dll or some thing that can thread them and not block the vb script (its the blocking while sending the usb data that is causes the table to stutter)

[numiah]

Pretty interesting.
If only I knew how to do these things, I'd start programming instantly !

[rooter]

The LEDWiz only seems to have a problem when lots of LEDs are flashing at the same time. Most of the game runs fine, but hitting jackpots or free replays on most tables causes lag. Not a great reward. I'm sure there is some solution to this. I am just a little surprised that I haven't heard the problem more often. It makes me think that something is wrong for me locally.

[rooter]

Found this tonight: http://www.hyperspin...hp/t-10980.html

Mr.Silver
We've implemented the multiple colour and multiple timer options but ledwiz is not able to handle it all. We get stuttering when multiple flasher colors are hit and after optimizing the script and trying many alternatives we get the same. We were able to calculate the required time for this amount of outputs to be set and the result is that ledwizard needs to much time to handle pwm brightness settings of multiple outputs. Also we've tried to execute the ledwiz script in another thread in a last chance to test for and asynchronous solution but unfortunately VPin crashes when ledwiz is executed in another separate thread.

This only means that ledwiz is not fast enough to handle our requirements, improving the code is not going to solve the problem, but is true that VBScript does not help here. My believe is there is a bottle neck in the RGB function of ledwiz wich in fact is calling two internal ledwiz functions and this also doubles the overhead. VPin documentation says we keep timer function fast and this does not happen here so stuttering happens.

A simple calculation reveals the following:

People reports 3m response for setting and output (directly calling from the ocx)

The rgb function is executed two times here one for setting the brightness of each output and another time to enable the output so imagine we've got
3 multiple rgb flashers this means:

3 flashers * 3 outputs each * 3 ms * 2 calls = 162ms

This is the best case scenario, i'm not counting vbscript execution time, not counting other required outputs to be enabled wich is the most probable thing to happen, so this is why i believe the problem is not in code.

Because our update timer is set to 100ms we've exceed this time by almost 50%, if we increase the 100ms update time we will miss a lot of solenoids and other hits of the ball. So no solution here.

Only thing i was able to think of, was doing the ledwiz update in another thread allowing vpin to continue working while ledwiz is doing its things, but unfortunately vpin crashes when trying to do this.

If any one can think of a possible solution i'll be glad to hear it.

chriz99
here is the new ledcontrol.vbs v2.4.1

http://www.mediafire...b72tpuy83xb89o2

- Solved rgb stuttering problem
- Removed pacdrive suport, due to faster ledwiz switching
- Fixed ON Color bug
- Added support for shaker intensity: Ex: S20 5000 I35 (Turn on the shaker for 5 seconds with and intensity of 35)
- Added support for multiple timers and frequency repetition
- Added support for multiple flashers colors
- Fixed W/S bug

this version comes with a 60ms timer for faster ledwiz action (instead the 100ms previous one). works very good for roger an me. if you have problems, set it simply back to 100


gTimerFreq = 60 ' global frequency timer set to 100 ms

to


gTimerFreq = 100 ' global frequency timer set to 100 ms


please support also the new LedWiz configuration tool, could be a real time saver. check out http://www.hyperspin...ead.php?t=11584

However, I am using v2.4.5. Maybe I can configure the LEDs to not flash so many at once and still be appealing or maybe there is some other answer out there that I am missing.

[rooter]

Problem solved. The online app was acting up and generated a bad .ini file for me. I regenerated and chose "non pwm flasher color config" mode just to be safe. Everything is working perfectly now!

[gwjrabbit]

Problem solved. The online app was acting up and generated a bad .ini file for me. I regenerated and chose "non pwm flasher color config" mode just to be safe. Everything is working perfectly now!

Yeah, I find everything works much better if I just have things on and off, not using any of the "color" commands at all.

[titanpoker41]

Hello , sorry for my english ,i am french

i have duo core 2.9 , 3 go , xp 32 , gtx 460
vp9 , ledwiz and 5 flasher rgb

when i play , the table is lag

sorry i don t understand you solution

do you please give me you solution