Jump to content



Photo
- - - - -

Time for a new video card--questions


  • Please log in to reply
24 replies to this topic

#1 BobAlbright

BobAlbright

    Pinball Wizard

  • Platinum Supporter
  • 2,304 posts
  • Location:York, Pa. USA

  • Flag: United States of America

  • Favorite Pinball: Attack from Mars

Posted 17 August 2017 - 04:26 PM

I want to upgrade my pinball machine (a Virtuapin) with a new video card. It seems the state of the emulation is now exceeding the capabilities of my current cards. It has 2 cards in it--a Geforce 8400GS (back glass) and a GTX660 (table). I've read that I could replace both of these cards with one and get better performance (less stutter). My question--Can I choose ANY card? (want to get the best one available (1080ti?)cost not important) Does the motherboard that it plugs into have anything to do with it? I don't want to spend a couple hundred dollars on a card that won't work with my setup. And the pinball machine uses XP. Not sure if that has anything to do with it either. Thanks


Edited by BobAlbright, 17 August 2017 - 04:30 PM.

"and in the end , the love you take is equal to the love you make"


#2 Umpa

Umpa

    Pinball Fan

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 740 posts

  • Flag: United States of America

  • Favorite Pinball: AC/DC

Posted 17 August 2017 - 05:03 PM

If the motherboard has a 16x pci express slot then you would be fine with the 1080

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk
1060 Is more than enough if you want to save a little money and all screens run off of it

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk

#3 BobAlbright

BobAlbright

    Pinball Wizard

  • Platinum Supporter
  • 2,304 posts
  • Location:York, Pa. USA

  • Flag: United States of America

  • Favorite Pinball: Attack from Mars

Posted 17 August 2017 - 05:19 PM

Thanks for the reply Umpa. How can I tell if my mobo has 16x PCI? Sorry..I know enough about computers to be dangerous

"and in the end , the love you take is equal to the love you make"


#4 Rajo Joey

Rajo Joey

    Pinball Fan

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1,489 posts
  • Location:Niedersachsen

  • Flag: Germany

  • Favorite Pinball: Attack from Mars, Abra Ca Dabra and many old EM-Tables

Posted 17 August 2017 - 05:28 PM

Take a look in the manual. Or post model and type of the mb.

Gesendet von meinem SGP511 mit Tapatalk

Edited by Joey2001, 17 August 2017 - 05:29 PM.

Rajo Joey - My front-end-files; Hundreds of Audio- and Videorecordings in high quality for Playfield (4k/60FPS) and Backglass (HD), Wheels & POV-Files: The Media-Post

https://www.facebook...02697096474910/

https://www.facebook...oups/VPAddicts/

https://www.facebook...oups/VPjunkies/


#5 exradar

exradar

    Hobbyist

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 11 posts

  • Flag: United States of America

  • Favorite Pinball: Lord of the Rings, Attack from Mars, TOTAN

Posted 17 August 2017 - 05:44 PM

(**SAFETY FIRST**, unplug your computer from the outlet before you ever begin to open the side/front panels)

 

Hey Bob, 

 

There are a couple of things to consider before making the plunge for a new card: (just take a quick glance at the info below, afterwards I make a point finally)

 

1) Motherboard Expansion Slots:

      - PCI Express 3.0 x 16 (standard on all modern motherboards since 2011) (typically there is very small print above or below each slot)

         + You mentioned that you currently use a GTX 660, which means that any other card WILL work in that same slot.

 

2) RAM:

      - At least 8 Gigabytes of DDR3 RAM (frequency doesn't really matter, but each stick of RAM *MUST* match (i.e. 1600, 2133, etc.)

         + 4GB will suffice for most systems running no more than 1080p. But 8GB has become the new standard in "store-bought" computers, therefore Windows will most likely expect 8GB to operate smoothly.

            ++ It's the cheapest component in the system, but that doesn't mean it's the least valuable.

 

3) Power Supply:

      - If you power supply isn't relatively new (less than 5 years old) OR has some kind of Full System warranty (Bronze, Silver, Gold, etc.), it is time to upgrade. If it blows, you could lose absolutely everything. Safety First!

      - IMPORTANT: If your power supply cannot support the new Graphics Card power requirements (wattage and single rail amperage), this WILL effect the system.

         + For instance: Corsair CX500 Bronze Certified ($40): It has 5 "rails", 2 of which are +12V and -12V (Volts), but only one of them supports 456W (Watts). (This is on the label on the bottom of the unit)

 

4) CPU (Central Processing Unit):

      - This is less important than the GPU (graphics processor) in regards to Virtual Pinball performance, because there is not that much that the GPU will not be handling.

         + At a minimum, the CPU needs to be a dual core (each additional core, 4,6,8, greatly increases performance), with a minimum of 2.5 GHz (clock rate).

            ++ The more cores a CPU has, the less GHz required to outperform lesser CPUs, and decreases power consumption and heat. (Fun fact for people who like quiet systems)

 

5) Operating System (OS):

      - This is least important, but worth mentioning. The OS differences in performance from XP -> 10 are pretty huge in some respects, but more specifically they directly relate to Nvidia and AMD graphics drivers.

         + Most major updates to these drivers are for modern PC games, but occasionally they have a major update that allows for more serious improvements related to CPU (main processor) and GPU (graphics processor) sharing loads.

         + This is where the updated Windows 10 shines regarding lower end CPUs and GPUs dividing workloads and overall performance increases substantially.

 

NOTE:

      - (Hard Drive Replacement) - "SSD" (Solid State Drive, no mechanical parts) performance is also a major update with modern Operating Systems. This will increase your load times drastically (minutes -> seconds).

 

OKAY!!! So in a nutshell:

      - If you are willing to pay $800 (cost of GTX 1080 ti on 8/17/17) you had better have at minimum, all the things I described above. Because a 1080ti is supreme overkill (so much so that I would say it's almost a silly purchase :clnglasses: ).

      - I'd suggest something like a GTX 1060 6GB or RX 580 4GB, both of which are roughly $300, you could easily play any table available today in 4K. While also possibly eliminating the requirement to upgrade MANY other parts in your current system.

 

I hope I didn't go overboard with the explanation and I hope I helped in some small way.  :dblthumb:


Edited by exradar, 22 August 2017 - 05:46 PM.


#6 Umpa

Umpa

    Pinball Fan

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 740 posts

  • Flag: United States of America

  • Favorite Pinball: AC/DC

Posted 17 August 2017 - 05:46 PM

Nice reply exradar!

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk

#7 gtxjoe

gtxjoe

    VPF Veteran

  • VIP
  • 5,159 posts

  • Flag: United States of America

  • Favorite Pinball: Medieval Madness, AbraCadabra



Contributor

Posted 17 August 2017 - 06:06 PM

Hmm, you have a GTX 660 which is completely usable with VPX.  I guess you can max out more settings if you upgrade to a 1080, but I would try moving the Backglass to the GTX 660 first.

 

Do you have AMD based or Intel based PC?  I did have stutter with AMD and the GTX 660.  I moved to Intel i5 and noticed improvements



#8 Carny_Priest

Carny_Priest

    Pinball Fan

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1,258 posts
  • Location:Austin, TX

  • Flag: United States of America

  • Favorite Pinball: EATPM

Posted 17 August 2017 - 06:12 PM

Keep your card and your money. I run three screens using GTX660 with my playfield and bg at 4K DSR. Performs with VPX just fine. Toss the second GPU. It does not help you.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Edited by Carny_Priest, 17 August 2017 - 06:15 PM.


#9 blipblop

blipblop

    Hobbyist

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 16 posts
  • Location:Sweden

  • Flag: Denmark

  • Favorite Pinball: Monster bash, Attack from Mars

Posted 17 August 2017 - 08:38 PM

Probably a 1060 6Gb memory is perfect at the moment.

 

I got and old Intel I5 (4670) then i bought a really good G-card.

Asus 1070 GTX,  the 3 fans are just for show ;)

Playing the newest  most demanding VPX tables with  all grafic option on max, no fans are spinning, temp is always under 50 Celsius this summer.

Only tried the card with 3 screens, playfield 4K resolution, the card is still waiting for more to do -;)

 

My choice was not to buy the fastest G-card on the market.

I went for a card with a smart and good cooling solution!

Spinning fans collects dust and then  fans must spin faster, more noise and problems in the future.



#10 owr084

owr084

    Neophyte

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 1 posts

  • Flag: United States of America

  • Favorite Pinball: Williams Flash

Posted 17 August 2017 - 10:50 PM

Just how much graphics power is needed for the backglass?  My motherboard (gigabyte GA-Z97MX Gaming 5) has - 1 x HDMI port, supporting a maximum resolution of 4096x2160@24Hz or 2560x1600@60Hz driven by an onboard graphics (Intel HD 4600) chipset.  Is that sufficient? 


Edited by owr084, 17 August 2017 - 10:50 PM.


#11 STV

STV

    Enthusiast

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 436 posts

  • Flag: United States of America

  • Favorite Pinball: Varies. 140 in the list ATM.

Posted 18 August 2017 - 02:49 AM

What is said above is good stuff.   I'll summarize for Bob first by saying a 1050ti might be a good choice if moving all screens to the 660 doesn't work out.  owr084 don't bother trying to run on that 4600 intel graphics chipset.  Bob you could run "msinfo32"  and it might show you some data in the "system model" field that identifies the motherboard so you could google some specs.
 
I built a core i3 4160 on a B85 chipset HD4600 graphics set. Thought maybe running the playfield on a 1050ti and the BG and DMD on the HD4600 would be fine.  no-go.  Well, it ran "most" things somewhat acceptably.
 
I upped to a compatible core i5 4570S.  Disabled the onboard video and moved all three screens to the 1050ti.  Smooth like butter.  With only a few exceptions, which I'm chalking up to an optimization problem with the particular tables that I haven't been arsed to delve into yet.  Tweaking a setting or two resolves most problems. 
 
Good luck!


#12 Schlabber34

Schlabber34

    Enthusiast

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 311 posts

  • Flag: Germany

  • Favorite Pinball: High Speed

Posted 18 August 2017 - 08:07 AM

I use a GTX950 with a good Pentium Dual Core and 4Gb ram. This is the absolute minimum for BruteForce 60fps on a dual screen cab. On some Tables i have to turn BF off to get smooth gameplay (TWD f.e.).

Gesendet von meinem SM-A510F mit Tapatalk

#13 BobAlbright

BobAlbright

    Pinball Wizard

  • Platinum Supporter
  • 2,304 posts
  • Location:York, Pa. USA

  • Flag: United States of America

  • Favorite Pinball: Attack from Mars

Posted 30 August 2017 - 02:08 PM

Well, I've made a decision on my upgrade..going with a 1060 and also doubling the ram to eight gig. Want to thank all those who responded. Will I experience any kind of reconfiguring issues when I plug this new card in?

"and in the end , the love you take is equal to the love you make"


#14 STAT

STAT

    Pinball and Arcade Freak

  • VIP
  • 4,986 posts
  • Location:Wels - Austria

  • Flag: Austria

  • Favorite Pinball: Twilight Zone

Posted 30 August 2017 - 02:14 PM

1060 (6GB) is really enough, for save Money: 1050 Ti (4GB) would be the same good for VP(X) ...
I use both Card(s) for Mining atm. ...

Cant believe myself, using a GTX 760 only in Cab ! Without Troubles :)

Edited by STAT, 30 August 2017 - 02:18 PM.


#15 toxie

toxie

    VPF Veteran

  • VP Dev Team
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,746 posts
  • Location:berlin, germany

  • Flag: Germany

  • Favorite Pinball: AFM

Posted 30 August 2017 - 02:35 PM

As for the PCIexpress question:

 

Right click on desktop -> NVIDIA Control Panel -> Help -> System Information

Scroll down in the "Details" list and find "Bus", which should say "PCI Express x16 Gen3" (or similar)



#16 hauntfreaks

hauntfreaks

    Real 4K Tables Since 2013

  • VIP
  • 2,523 posts
  • Location:South Jersey

  • Flag: United States of America

  • Favorite Pinball: -<3<3<3 All Real Pins



Posted 30 August 2017 - 05:21 PM

1060 (6GB) is really enough, for save Money: 1050 Ti (4GB) would be the same good for VP(X) ...
I use both Card(s) for Mining atm. ...

Cant believe myself, using a GTX 760 only in Cab ! Without Troubles :)

 
I have a 760 in my setup now and run BFaa with smooth play on all tables
I do have a 1050 ready to go in,but my lazy factor is winning that war....


 26794541816_30ca1cca80_o.gif 43109635392_fc11af1a57_o.gif


#17 smithy001

smithy001

    Enthusiast

  • Gold Supporter
  • 65 posts
  • Location:Born

  • Flag: Netherlands

  • Favorite Pinball: AFM, MM, STTNG.

  • PS3 Gamer Tag: flappypedals01

Posted 24 July 2018 - 08:30 PM

One year later,

 

maybe nice to mention that the next generation of Nvidia GPU's will be coming soon.

The prices for cards like the GTX 1080 (1070ti will follow soon) are now dropping slowly. In Germany it started this month, and the Netherlands will probably be following soon.

This trend WILL continue and prices will drop even more when the new cards (GTX 1100 series or maybe GTX 2000, who knows) are finally released.

Expected earliest fall or winter 2018, do some googling on it. "Nvidia turing".

 

So, if you're thinking about upgrading and still got some patience left, wait with buying the GPU, it will save you a lot of bucks!

 

Bucks that can be spent on upgrading other parts like CPU or RAM or cooling, or maybe even buying a 1080 instead of a 1070 Ti like me, future-proofing for years to come.

 

I am still in doubt on buying a 1070ti. But now the 1080 comes into my budget-range of around €500 for the GPU...

For the first time in my life, I am starting to show some patience :otvclap:

 

wish list: i5-8500 or i5-8600k CPU, B360 or Z370 MB, 16GB 3000 RAM, GTX 1070 Ti or GTX 1080.

Roughly doubling my currents specs, except for the CPU of course. I will keep you posted when I start building.


Edited by smithy001, 24 July 2018 - 08:36 PM.

W10 64, 750W, MSI Z370, i5-8600K 6 x 4,0 GHz, 16GB DDR4 3300, MSI 1070Ti 8GB OC.
PF Samsung 37" HD 1920x1080. BG Acer 27" 1920x1200. Samsung SSD. WD HDD.
LED-Wiz, GP-Wiz 40, RGB Buttons. Trust 5.1 Sound, Logitech wireless keyboard.
VP9.21 + VPX 10.7.3. VPM3.2. DOF R2. Pinball X with +/- 300 tables.


#18 hlr53

hlr53

    Pinball Fan

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 683 posts
  • Location:Kettering OH

  • Flag: United States of America

  • Favorite Pinball: 1964 Williams Palooka Joe

Posted 25 July 2018 - 12:57 AM

I have a GTX1080 in my cab and yes it is bigly overkill. Well worth it to me because I just max out everything and forget it. No monkeying with graphic settings in any platform. I bought it before the miners drove up GPU prices.

The 1060 6 gig is also an excellent card. I have one in my Alienware laptop.

Former Cab: 40" Haier, 28" I-INC, i7-6700, 1080 GPU, v3DMD, 4D7 solenoids. Altec-Lansing speakers and sub. Artwork by Stuzza. Printing by Brad Bowman. VR HP reverb


#19 PainkillerAlice

PainkillerAlice

    Multi-Level Madman

  • Platinum Supporter
  • 2,685 posts
  • Location:Indiana

  • Flag: United States of America

  • Favorite Pinball: I like multi-level pinball the most


  • Trophies:

Posted 25 July 2018 - 05:31 PM

If you want  to save a little money, get a GTX1070 and overclock it. You will get about the same performance as the 1080 if not more.


Edited by Practicedummy, 25 July 2018 - 05:31 PM.

I could have been smart, but I never learned anything by being smart!

 

 


#20 smithy001

smithy001

    Enthusiast

  • Gold Supporter
  • 65 posts
  • Location:Born

  • Flag: Netherlands

  • Favorite Pinball: AFM, MM, STTNG.

  • PS3 Gamer Tag: flappypedals01

Posted 01 August 2018 - 08:40 PM

Update: just ordered an Intel i5-8600k, Cooler Master ML120 watercooler, MSI Z370 MB, 16 GB 3000 RAM, 750W Corsair PSU.

I'm waiting for GPU prices to drop a bit more, and save-up some extra $€,  and make up my mind on what to buy, 1070ti or 1080? Maybe next-gen, who knows?

If this ain't future-proofing,  :hmm: I don't know.

 

Maybe someone please try to answer this: what is the deciding or limiting factor in a GPU used with VPX?

For example the amount of cuda cores, or the total memory frequency, or the total VRAM?

The designers may know what areas needs to be future-proofed, and other areas may need less attention.

 

I will keep you posted.


Edited by smithy001, 01 August 2018 - 08:42 PM.

W10 64, 750W, MSI Z370, i5-8600K 6 x 4,0 GHz, 16GB DDR4 3300, MSI 1070Ti 8GB OC.
PF Samsung 37" HD 1920x1080. BG Acer 27" 1920x1200. Samsung SSD. WD HDD.
LED-Wiz, GP-Wiz 40, RGB Buttons. Trust 5.1 Sound, Logitech wireless keyboard.
VP9.21 + VPX 10.7.3. VPM3.2. DOF R2. Pinball X with +/- 300 tables.