39 replies to this topic

[Gamester]

There's a chicken & egg thing here.

 

1. People won't buy(or build themselves) a big 'ol pinball cab if there's no good software support for it.

2. People won't make/support software for pincabs if there's no good install base for pincabs. This is speaking on a commercial perspective. 

 

My idea? Take 2 monitors & a small PC and put hinges to make a tiny cab. Fold it up for EZ storage, and lay it on a table, flip up the 2nd monitor: instant pinball. You'll be the hit of Timmy's 9th birthday party. 

 

This is a good point.  A reasonably priced, portable machine that would make a 'cabinet-like' configuration more accessible to the masses would probably help move this process along more quickly.  Noah's, mini-pin is not too far off, but I still think an even smaller, less expensive solution may be in order...

[TedB]

Cab owners might be a very small niche group, but probably the most vocal group of virtual pinball players. Being the first commercial company to release a cab version will certainly attract a lot of attention and free advertisement. 

If the game is good and they have a flexible method of distribution I am sure most cab users will buy the game. That is my main concern though. I don't want to go online with my cab and don't want to install W7 or 8.   

Edited by TedB, 20 February 2013 - 10:02 PM.

[chepas]

Could be good for some people, personally I can't stand Zen pinball. Their games do look good and have no doubt they would look very nice in a cabinet layout but 80% of them are way too easy - assisted shots.

Change the slope and the ball savers, then its much harder ..
Works in Pinball FX 2 on win 8, dont know about zen pinball

The only thing I can remember about any difficulty settings in Zen is none. You can turn ball trails on & off. This is probably down to only having played mobile/ds versions.

[codeena]

I'd ask, why would the developers even mention cabinet support if they were not truly considering it? I'm guessing that a lot of cabinet owners would hold off on purchasing some or any of their current titles just to wait for the PC version with cabinet support. At least that's what I like to tell myself as I anxiously wait for great, concrete news.

[nickbuol]

OK.  I am just thinking that this won't happen either.  I mean, as people mentioned, there is no PC version out after promises for a LONG time.  Also, some person signs up on BYOAC just minutes after the post above it in the link your provided, and just because this person has the name "Neil" does not mean squat these days.  I could create an account with the name ZStudios or something and make a post.   This Neil_S was online for a total of a single 4 minute session.  If he was that interested in the project of adding support, he would have been back since then.  Sure, you could argue annonymity is why, but I am not easily fooled.

 

I just don't believe it to be a "real" post, especially since ZS can't get us a PC version for the masses.  Why would they want to casually post on a public forum inside a specific project build (not slamming your awesome build and components) of what could be seen as a major announcement? 

 

 

So if people want to still chat and speculate, got for it.  Just take it with at least an ounce of reality from a company that can't produce a product outside of phone/console gaming.

[Gamester]

nickbuol, I understand your skepticism, however, I can absolutely confirm that it was really Neil Sorens from Zen that made the post on my thread, as I was personally in contact with Mel Kirk, Zen's VP of Marketing, for over a week before I even started my thread, and also received an email from both Mel and Neil that same evening that he posted to the forum.

 

Conspiracy theory squashed... 

Edited by Gamester, 21 February 2013 - 06:34 PM.

[settingsons]

 
Conspiracy theory squashed... 

Damn - love a conspiracy theory

Just read your thread Gamester over on BYOAC - you have some serious kit there - it's gonna be awesome.

Good news Zen are showing some interest in full cab support. A non Win8 version would also be ideal - I currently dual boot from two drives in my cabinet using a hard drive switch to play FX2 in portrait.

If you get a chance to make suggestions to them please ask for a real chrome ball option as their ones aren't very authentic apart from Captain America which is OK. Need to wear sunglasses to play with the others. For some reason the bright balls blur the surrounding area too. I posted on their forum about it although they didn't respond.

Edited by settingsons, 21 February 2013 - 06:51 PM.

[CaptainNeo]

i don't know if this is really good news.  If they start doing this, they may decide that all these VP recreations infringe on "their turf" and start some bullshit.   I think they should stay focused on their phones and everything else and stay away from us backyard users.

[Sir Cheddar]

i don't know if this is really good news.  If they start doing this, they may decide that all these VP recreations infringe on "their turf" and start some bullshit.   I think they should stay focused on their phones and everything else and stay away from us backyard users.

I don't think they will - recreations are not their turf, they do originals only. We don't infringe anything of Zen's IP, as far as I know.

And if they try something I'm positive they get some pretty bad press in the pinball community. Nothing for them to win going that route.

[CaptainNeo]

if they only do originals, I don't think it could be a problem.  But the ones who do licensed themes.  It would not be good.

[nickbuol]

When, and.more importantly, IF they ever come out with a working PC version, and then when and again IF they have some sort of real cabinet support, then you can call the "conspiracy theory" squashed. Maybe I should just call it what it really has been for a long time... Vaporware... - Posted via Tapatalk 3.7 beta

Edited by nickbuol, 24 February 2013 - 06:24 PM.

[KOPTango]

Found some info on this today on Zens site (see Solitudes post - post 2) in Win 8/Questions about the Windows 8 app and tables Forum (not sure if we are allowed to do links on this forum).

 

 

Looks like a proper Win8, Win7 (and possibly other OS) PC version out relatively soon, with basic cab support to be added after launch.They are targeting Steam for distribution.

 

Happy days!

[The Loafer]

I have been pondering on why PA or Zen or the propinball guys are supporting a hardware configuration that at best may give them 250-500 extra sales (for now). Is it possible that aside from competition between themselves, they are seeing this as a way to grow their market? It is true that so far, there are about 5 extra sales of these apps from people who've tried my pincab. Now many of my friends already had an appreciation for pinball, so I don't think this is truly reflecting the potential, but it is interesting nevertheless.

[Rincewind]

After reading all the posts above, all I can say is that Zen should release a working PC version and then "dream" about the working cabinet relase. 'nuff said...

[Gamester]

After reading all the posts above, all I can say is that Zen should release a working PC version and then "dream" about the working cabinet relase. 'nuff said...

 

That's exactly their intent...release a PC version, then endeavor to provide some of the cabinet friendly features as updates...

[MTPPC]

I think we are seeing a lot of wishful thinking here. For what reasons will a company invest in a non-viable market?

 

1. To develop the market and be a leader

2. Product development in pursuit of vertical integration (i.e. They want to build cabs)

 

I don't think Zen or Farsight are doing either of these things so that makes me think these guys are just telling cab owners what they want to hear. I hope I'm wrong, but I've seen a lot of vaporware in the past. And speaking of vaporware, what is the delivery estimate on those WOZ right now?

[KOPTango]

Being an optimist...

What about marketing / advertising? Showing their products in a cab at trade shows would give a great impression and probably at a relatively cheap cost compared to other forms of advertising. They already have a digital Dmd that can be moved around the play field, they have a portrait mode that could be tweaked so would it be that hard and costly to move the existing Dmd to a second monitor and put a basic static image as a translight as a first step. I'm sure it's not as easy as it sounds but they are a talented developer.

As many have said the cab market is a niche market... So a quality cab with their software in it could be a good way to show case their product because not many people have or have seen these cabs before. Catch attention and headlines with a cab and have the desktop version there to sell to the masses.

[Roo]

A lot of good points here.  I know the wait for any sort of regular PC version has been very frustrating.  I've been following this for about 2 years now.  But I'm remaining hopefully optimistic as well.  The thing to remember is that Zen (and Farsight) are not huge companies -- and they are very passionate.  While they are a business that needs to be profitable, these guys are pinball nuts as well.  I bet you they would love to see their game running at max settings on a high-end PC in a cabinet.

 

And yes, it would be an excellent showpiece for conventions and tradeshows to generate buzz.  I remember there was a ton of press around the 3-screen racing cabinets that Turn 10 showed Forza III off on at E3 a few years back.  It was something that most people had never seen before and probably didn't even know was possible - just like a virtual pinball cabinet.  Same with that Frogger example - you think any mainstream video game site would have posted anything about an iOS Frogger pinball game in the middle of the year's biggest gaming convention otherwise?  But I remember seeing several posts about it because of the cabinets.

 

The passion and dedication of even one person can go a long way.  I remember hearing that the 3-screen mode in the original Forza for Xbox 1 was developed by the guy who did the network code because he finished early and had spare time on his hands!

 

Now most people will not put together their own triple-screen racing rig (I actually did) or build/buy their own pinball cabinet (I have a VirtuaPin coming soon...), but it can definitely further the hobby and help the business.

 

Heck, I wasn't even into pinball until a couple years ago.  I had never really played growing up (I'm 30).  There just weren't many around and video games always got my attention first.  Then I put together a MAME cabinet with a control panel that had pinball buttons on the side.  So I gave Future Pinball a try and really got into it.  Then I discovered Pinball FX2, then VP.  Now it's a couple years later -- I've been to 2 Chicago Pinball Expos, visited the Las Vegas Pinball Hall of Fame and now ordered a VirtuaPin.  And my interest has generated some interest from friends -- even if it is just them buying The Pinball Arcade on PS3.

 

Bottom line, (virtual) pinball seems to be really gaining in popularity.  I hope it continues and everyone can enjoy their favorite titles on whatever device they want, from tablets all the way up to full cabinets.  Thank you to everyone involved in the community who is helping push to make these things happen.

[LoadedWeapon]

Well I will just wait and hope for cab support.. As far as virtual pinball I think its growing alot and catching on I know that I have helped build 3 cabs and about to start on another one. Everyone one that comes to my house I show them the pinball cab and they go crazy... Old and young hell my mom is in her 60's and my grandpa is 87 and they love it aswell do my wife and kids and friends etc... For every cab build thats more and more people that it gets introduced too. We are a growing!!!

[The Loafer]

That Forza example above is just a fantastic and perferct analogy. Same with Flight Sim's that support 3 monitors for a truer cockpit view, no one is going to convince me that there are thousands of sales for such support, but when you show it (and Forza) to a bunch of people, your market can grow out of this on the regular sales.

 

Here's hoping we start seeing some of this support sooner rather than later. This isn't a knock against the company, I'm just getting old