69 replies to this topic

[wiesshund]

If you have windows itself running in cabinet mode (Which is a heck of a lot easier for editing tables)
How do you get VPX to list the resolutions properly?

It shows the monitor, in the appropriate resolution in display settings (1080x1920)
But in the choices to display the game itself at, there is nothing appropriate at all.

Im sure there is a way to do this, i just dont know it, and did not find anything in a search
 

[mrjcrane]

So we are in the minority here since most people are leaving the OS in Landscape mode when this install it into a pinbox and most FULLSCREEN table layout is done with a 270 degree rotation to support that. But like you I preferred a Portrait Orientation when I built my cabinet to leave the OS in Portrait mode and all apps in Portrait mode, for the same reasons you identified. The way I handle this in vpx is to reshape the table/camera view. (Pinball FX3 and Pinball Arcade are both suited for this kind of Portrait Orientation). So, in VPX table design screen, I do use 1080x1920 then in I'll do a table rotation of the "FULLSCREEN" table to 0 degrees instead of 270 degrees. Then I adjust the x & y scaling. I start with X=1.35 scale and Y = 1.0. Then I also prefer to set the X Offset back to 0. This gets my table pretty close to normal then I don't have to use any additional apps to do on the fly table rotations and I don't have to stand at the side of the cabinet to do any table mods or OS duties. I face the cabinet head on at all times. You may also need to check the stretch ball feature, I don't remember without looking. Good Luck. Let me know if you get stuck. I have this setup all dialed in.

 

I'v been kind of wishing and hoping for the development of a 4th video mode that is suited for a Portrait Screen Orientation in a pinball cabinet/box.

Edited by mrjcrane, 05 September 2020 - 01:36 AM.

[wiesshund]

Well, the problem is, VPX does not offer me a resolution, when windows is in portrait mode, that is bigger than a small box
So i can not resize the table to anything useful

1 sec, i will show you an example from this laptop

[mrjcrane]

I see your dilemma, if you are using the onboard INTEL graphics chip it may not be able to handle that, I ran into this early in my build as well. I'v gone through 2 upgrades on the video card already. Are you using a PC or a Laptop to power your game cabinet? I started with a laptop but when Pinball FX3 was released all new FX games ran only in super slow motion so I switched or to a MicroATX board and dedicated video card. Also 1 more thing, sometimes there is a setting in the video driver that says use all video modes, so 1080x1920 may be hiding in there if you can get the card to show all modes. A few other tricks are to drop the cycles from 60 to 30 or changing the color depth from 32 bit down to 16 bit.

Edited by mrjcrane, 05 September 2020 - 02:04 AM.

[wiesshund]

Most of the time i am confined to using this laptop, i only see my desktop when i am home, which is not frequent
So i do most of my playing or tinkering from the laptop.

I thought it might be nicer just to rotate the OS also, since this laptop folds totally flat.
Then i can tinker with a table easier.

I wind up using it rotated for reading anyways.

Now the funny thing i just discovered is, if i launch the table then rotate the screen, its perfect.
Here you can see i flipped the screen, post launch of this table in desktop mode


So seems mostly a matter of vpx just not comprehending what is going on screen wise.
Probably a matter of it wanting to see the info spelled out implicitly, and windows/intel driver simply working on an implied basis?
Maybe?

I think VPX stores its settings in registry, so maybe i could try modifying the reg value for the resolution and transpose the values.

That or i can just edit, flip, launch, flip again.
You get used to running the mouse sideways after a while

Oh i just found something that works
With exclusive full screen enabled, then i CAN pick the rotated resolution.

Just not in non fullscreen mode

which makes it not optimal for testing or building, as a lot of time i will put the dmd etc on the table in a corner or what not.
but it does at least mean you could run a cabinet with the OS rotated
since you probably do not edit and tweak etc on a cabinet on a single screen, very much.

 

but, i can make a flip flop POV and resize the table for the after the fact rotation
save that POV and use it when i am non exclusive full screen doing stuff

 

edit
Pic below this post is actually how i wind up playing or editing a lot
thats an old android phone running space desk to use as a backglass monitor.

It is small, but it works

Edited by wiesshund, 05 September 2020 - 02:39 AM.

[mrjcrane]

So I used to reshape the Desktop Table to suit me for the portrait oriented cabinet, then I stopped modifying that one and instead just reshape the FULLSCREEN version for the purpose of being in my cabinet. I realized I would never be happy with Landscape OS in my cabinet. That way the desktop version is still correct when I move over to my real desktop. Let me know if you get stuck on anything else.

[mrjcrane]

So using your example with the Beat Time table, which is very close to what you are after. You could actually reshape that desktop table to push the unwanted stuff out of frame and just make the left and right edges of the table snug up against the left and right border of your cabinet screen. Something like x scale =1.3 or 1.4 might do it. But then you have to send your B2s and DMD over to your laptop as screen #2. If you want just a 1 screen system you could get away with shrinking the table vertically Y Axis then use a small section of the top of the cabinet screen to do the DMD presentation (something like 200-300 pixels of height in the DMD might do the trick. Just some options to consider. 

OR 

Reshape and rotate the FULLSCREEN version of the table to have the same dimensions, scaling, rotation and aspect ratios as the desktop version has. With the FULLSCREEN version of the table it removes all the extra background fluff/scoring/graphics that are native to the Desktop version of the table.

OR

You may be able to experiment with FSS (Full Single Screen Mode) but the DMD stuff can be a little tricky here as it may not be twisted in the right direction.

My basic methodology in my cabinet is to use FULLSCREEN (for the table part only sent to screen #1), I rotate, reshape and reposition it, the then I send all my B2s and DMD to screen #2.

The laptop part is what makes your install just a little challenging.

Edited by mrjcrane, 05 September 2020 - 06:15 PM.

[wiesshund]

Well, for what i need on the laptop, the grossly distorted display in the screen shot is fine for the most part
as it is mostly when bouncing back and forth between table and editor, cause it is so much nicer to edit vertically

 

And if i put it in exclusive full screen mode, the resolution i want is available.
i just dont have it on because a lot of times editing i will have the DMD etc all sitting on the same screen, makes it easier if i am like trying to time delay a kicker
to a specific point in a video etc.

 

But yea being able to edit the table in vertical fashion and see the whole thing is a big bonus.
You can see things that you otherwise miss until later, like noticing that this angle is bad and no one will ever be able to make this shot etc.

When you see the whole table in the editor, it kind of jumps up and down and says hey look at me, this dont work so good.

[mrjcrane]

Yep I'm with you, table edits and design work much easier in vertical mode. Have you tried messing around with FSS (Full Single Screen Mode)?

[nromo]

Is it not possible to setup VPX in single screen portrait mode with the DMD on top like we see in FX3 and the pinball arcade? If so, how? I can't find a single video or explanation of this.

Edited by nromo, 10 April 2021 - 07:35 AM.

[wiesshund]

Is it not possible to setup VPX in single screen portrait mode with the DMD on top like we see in FX3 and the pinball arcade? If so, how? I can't find a single video or explanation of this.

Do you mean like this?

 

 

 

If you want to do something like that, tell me your screen resolution, and i can help you out

 

I do not have FX3 so no idea what it looks like

but if you mean something like this

 

 

That is called FSS, and the table has to be specifically made to work that way

but in my honest opinion FSS is best on a vertically rotated display so you can get a decent amount of table length

Edited by wiesshund, 10 April 2021 - 09:39 AM.

[Wylte]

It's not exactly a FSS tutorial, but this video touches on positioning DMD and screen setup: https://youtu.be/9zcHjjA7MLE

I myself have a monitor in portrait! For a fresh install:
Backglass + Options selected (left side) -> uncheck test desktop -> enter FS (sounds like you want FSS, but I haven't tried it) from the drop-down -> change rotation to 0 (might be 180, just use the shape of the table to guide you) -> adjust settings to fit table into box -≥ F6 to get everything right

There's also a setting in preferences so the default isn't desktop orientation.

[wiesshund]

It's not exactly a FSS tutorial, but this video touches on positioning DMD and screen setup: https://youtu.be/9zcHjjA7MLE

I myself have a monitor in portrait! For a fresh install:
Backglass + Options selected (left side) -> uncheck test desktop -> enter FS (sounds like you want FSS, but I haven't tried it) from the drop-down -> change rotation to 0 (might be 180, just use the shape of the table to guide you) -> adjust settings to fit table into box -≥ F6 to get everything right

There's also a setting in preferences so the default isn't desktop orientation.

 

FSS the table has to be specifically made that way

Many people to not build it into their tables because it is little used, and kind of a pain in the ass to get it set up.
and it is hard to adjust the tables POV

 

But i can help him get a layout similar to what i am showing in landscape mode, but for vertical orientation
just have to know his screen resolution so i can figure the dimensions for the table backglass and DMD
Actually in vertical i would probably mimic a 2screen cab, and run the backglass with grill, and put the DMD on the grill

 

And since his screen is vertical, he can just work with the desktop POV
It will work very well.

(these are full on vertical cab POV's, but i would suggest a hybrid, cross between desktop and cab, works well with the reduced screen length)

 

 

Edited by wiesshund, 10 April 2021 - 09:56 AM.

[nromo]

 

It's not exactly a FSS tutorial, but this video touches on positioning DMD and screen setup: https://youtu.be/9zcHjjA7MLE

I myself have a monitor in portrait! For a fresh install:
Backglass + Options selected (left side) -> uncheck test desktop -> enter FS (sounds like you want FSS, but I haven't tried it) from the drop-down -> change rotation to 0 (might be 180, just use the shape of the table to guide you) -> adjust settings to fit table into box -≥ F6 to get everything right

There's also a setting in preferences so the default isn't desktop orientation.

 

FSS the table has to be specifically made that way

Many people to not build it into their tables because it is little used, and kind of a pain in the ass to get it set up.
and it is hard to adjust the tables POV

 

But i can help him get a layout similar to what i am showing in landscape mode, but for vertical orientation
just have to know his screen resolution so i can figure the dimensions for the table backglass and DMD
Actually in vertical i would probably mimic a 2screen cab, and run the backglass with grill, and put the DMD on the grill

 

And since his screen is vertical, he can just work with the desktop POV
It will work very well.

(these are full on vertical cab POV's, but i would suggest a hybrid, cross between desktop and cab, works well with the reduced screen length)

 

 

 

This is what I'm talking about! Except, no back glass taking up the space and no black (waisted) space on sides. But just the DMD overlaid over the playfield like FX3 does. I can't believe there is nothing on this anywhere I've looked! Portrait mode (cabinet, full screen rotated or whatever), with DMD. How do you size and position the DMD? My screen is 2560x1440. I want to use a 32" screen for this. I currently have a 27 inch that only pivots 90 Degrees, not 270 (some do this).  Here is an example video of FX3 in portrait with DMD at top. Link below.. He has his camera set to move with ball. I hate that! I set mine to not move.

 Pinball FX3 (Switch; Portrait - Off Screen) - YouTube

Edited by nromo, 10 April 2021 - 06:04 PM.

[gtxjoe]

You can move and resize the DMD with the mouse. To have the DMD on top of the playfield you need to turn off exclusive Fullscreen

[nromo]

Back glasses and topper videos and full DMD's are all nice, but not needed to play the game! This should only require a single display. Playing in landscape (horizontal) sucks because the tables are squashed and too small.

You can move and resize the DMD with the mouse. To have the DMD on top of the playfield you need to turn off exclusive Fullscreen

So this will work like in the video I posted of FX3 then?

How do you rotate the DMD to be horizontal in portrait mode?

Edited by nromo, 10 April 2021 - 06:23 PM.

[kiwi]

You shouldn't need to rotate the DMD, it rotates with the operating system.

[nromo]

Also, what is the difference between 'Full Screen' and 'Full Single Screen' in the Backglass/POV Graphics & Camera settings?

Thanks!

You shouldn't need to rotate the DMD, it rotates with the operating system.

So you're saying to rotate the display in Windows rather than in Backglass/POV settings?

[kiwi]

The DMD follows the rotation of the operating system, so there is no need to rotate it.

If you have the OS rotated 90 °, the DMD is rotated 90 ° as well.

[wiesshund]

physical size of screen does not matter, only pixel size

 

1) You need to rotate your OS when you are going to play
just put windows in portrait mode

 

2) this is probably best if you set desktop background to black, and dont have desktop show icons

 

3) You will need to do a few things by hand, that i can not do for you

In table editor, click backglass button
in the backglass details, set the desktop backdrop image to <none>

 

And if the backdrop had objects on it, like scoreboards etc, you will want to select them all (just drag a box around them all)

If they are locked (not highlighted in blue)

Lock Element                Ctrl + Shift + L
toggle that once or twice so all elements are unlocked

 

then just hold shift and up arrow until they are up outside the boundaries of the backbox area

DO NOT DELETE the objects, the table script might expect them to be there, you are just moving them out of the way

 

Yes, you have to do that one time, on each table, call it cost of living.

nothing complicated, and if you mess up, just close table without saving and re-open it

 

4) You want this zip file i made for you  ZIPPY FILE

 

there are 3 files in it

 

   autopov.pov  -  this goes into your tables folder.
It will attempt to properly orient the table on the screen.
It should work for most table as is, but there is no exact 1 size fits all for them.
If you find you need to fine tune a specific table, with table open in editor, 1st click file, then import, then POV
and pick the autopov.pov
That will put it in the ballpark, then you can fine tune from there, when done
dont save the table, because the autopov will over ride the table, click file and export and POV
and export as table name.pov, which over rides autopov.

 

   vertical rotated single screen.reg  -  This will orient VPX on the screen
it contains no other settings, only how VPX should appear on the screen, just double click it and allow it to import
if you change any vpx video settings, VPX will undo the screen layout, so save the reg file.
Adjust FSAA or lighting etc, then reiport the reg to put the screen layout back again
 

   ScreenRes.txt
This is your b2s backglass and b2s based DMD layout with everything sized and centered to the table
based on a 2k resolution, which you said you had
This file goes in the tables folder, overwrite the existing one

 

This has no effect on non b2s DMD's
for those, you simply drag and resize/position by hand

whether you use freezy's external DMD display, or just use VPM does not matter, though i recommend using freezy's DMD extensions

 

The end result will be this

 

 

 

*DISCLAIMER

Diablo's DMD is from using flexDMD 1.7 and freezy's 1.9.0 r10 beta DMD extensions
And the frame around it I made.