45 replies to this topic

[devorian]

Are there any tables that play and look better on FP?  I don’t know what it is about FP but it seems to lack that punch of VP. The tables may look OK on FP but what good is that if there is no game play? The ball just seems to be floating around the table most of the time. Now I know what you’re going to say…. It’s your PC…. I don’t think this is the case with a x4 860k quad core 4.30 ghz processor and I know some games like Batman Dark knight run much better, almost on par with the VP tables. I don't have this problem when playing VP tables I might add.

 

So the million-dollar question is there a FP version of a table that out rivals its VP counterpart?

 

And is there anything I can do to improve game play on FP?

[TT11]

Some things I found helpful to improve FP was running it under BAM for every single table. You can run different physics via loading 2.4, 2.5, 2.6, 2.7 and ZEDPhysics 1 and 1.1.  I also find that taking the time to realign the playfield using the zooming options and X,Y and Z coordinates helps also.  If there are older EM type tables that newer physics do not run well with, I find upping the Flipper Strength and Playfield angles can make a big difference to the way tables play.  Remember that there are no VP equivilents of original tables like Minions, Gone in 60 Seconds, Gremlins, Jaws, Die Hard...... etc.

[STAT]

In my opinion, if you really like Pinball there are only 2 Ways:

You have the real Machines or: stay at VP = get closer to the real Machines ( real ROM, very good Phys., great Comunity, always Updates )

Ok maybe a 3th: Pinball FX2 is also very nice!

Edited by STAT, 30 March 2016 - 11:00 AM.

[greeze]

...So the million-dollar question is there a FP version of a table that out rivals its VP counterpart?

 

 

[devorian]

There is no substitute for the real thing… Although on the pricey side now, I’m going to look out for a real table and all the headaches that come with that.

 

 I paid just £800 for my first table, a TAF machine around 12 years ago. I think I’ll need to re-mortgage the house in order to buy it again. Not that I would buy a TAF again. I like the flexibility of changing tables on my virtual table.

 

So the upshot is stick to VP tables….. For those original FP tables that look good and play OK’ish,  the likes of Jaws, Knight Rider etc. are there no plans for a VP conversion? Or would that not be possible?

[PinballShawn]

For a long time FP looked great, but played terribly. VP looked terrible, but played ok. At this point VP looks great and plays great, while FP still looks great, but still plays terribly. Yes, the new physics are better than they were, but they are still very wrong.

I still have FP on my cab, some tables are wonderful, but you have to accept that the physics are so far from real life that it's not funny. If you can deal with the 'video pinball' feel of it, it's a lot of fun. You cannot make them 'right', we have all tried.. for endless hours. It will never feel perfect unless the entire physics engine is rewritten. If you want realistic 'real world' feel, VP is the only thing out there right now. PBA doesn't feel right, PFX doesn't feel right to me either.

[RustyCardores]

I just turned FutureP off on my cab.  The tables are pretty no doubt, but the best of the VPX tables are just as nice (and some are being converted from FP anyway) plus VPX tables have the advantage of good physics.  I just can't bring myself to play those FP flippers anymore... and yes I was running BAM, SLAMt1LT tables and also applying additional physics mods, but still... those darn flippers  

[robertms]

If you want realistic 'real world' feel, VP is the only thing out there right now. PBA doesn't feel right, PFX doesn't feel right to me either.

True that.

[TNT2]

If you want realistic 'real world' feel, VP is the only thing out there right now. PBA doesn't feel right, PFX doesn't feel right to me either.

 

Pinball Arcade is what got me into virtual pinball. Previously nothing ever felt good enough to hold my attention for very long. After playing TPA naturally I came across VP. While the learning curve sucked to get it to work folks were right. It's worth it in the long run to learn how it works. 

 

I would say I preferred TPA over VP until physmod was introduced. That obviously was a big deal as the physics were getting really good. Now playing TPA the ball feels too floaty. Some tables are too easy. However I do think it's by design. Farsight is not catering to the die-hard-absolute-perfection crowd, but more to the pick up your iPad while you are waiting for something and just play for 20 minutes and not have your ball drain every 30 seconds crowd. 

Edited by TNT2, 31 March 2016 - 03:44 AM.

[devorian]

I’ve not entertained TPA seeing as there is no in game cab support. I know it is possible to set up 3 monitors, but if I’m going to spend money then least the developers can do is add cab support.

 

I’ve bought all the FX2 tables apart from the naff ones… Personally I wish Zen released all their tables as I prefer some of the older ones that are still available on the Xbox but not on steam.  FX2 plays well in my opinion. 

[Slydog43]

I like to support Zen since they choose to add cab support for the few that have cabs.  Don't know why TPA will not do anything and have said forever that they will.  That is just plain wrong in my book.  A good friend always tells me about the latest table from them, and I just don't care anymore.

 

Although still some work to come, timeshock looks incredible on my cab.

[playcade]

FP looks great, but has Saturn´s physics... VP is the best! And now, VPX rocks!!!!

 

But sometimes, good authors put bad physics values on VPX tables...I dont know why, perhaps because they dont own or dont play real pins to compare real ball behavior.

I have 5 real pins (old 80s pins) and play dayly, so can compare VPX to real life...

So, I made some changes in a VPX table.

Goodlooking tables need some physics changes.

I modified SMDM , by ALLKNOWING2012  (I cant stop playing that table now...I´m sick!!!!)

 

Here I go:

 

Getting Better the physics of SMDM 2.0:

Try 3 coins with the actual parameters, and then with these changes, and then you tell me.....

 

Table slope: change from 6 to 5,5

Gates elasticity: change from 0,6 to 0,9 .-  This will allow the ball to enter the saucer when start a new ball, like the real table, (watch youtube videos)

Bumpers Force: change  from 7 to 8,5

Slingshot Force: change from 0 to 2,9

Top Saucer force: Change from 5 to 15 open the SCRIPTS, line 144, change the last number (5) to 15 to increase the saucer power when release the ball.

 

The table behavior will be almost the same as the real pinball machine.

It took me 3 hours of investigations (and COINS) to get this working properly, in my opinion!

 

Thanks to the table author allknowing2012!!!!

 

You will remove FP from your cab  (as I did!)

 

Then do this, if you like to play for the replays:

 

How to set up FIRST REPLAY (240.000 pts) and SECOND REPLAY (500.000pts) according to the INSTRUCTIONS and REPLAYS CARDS:

 

Press the number 7 six times (pc keyboard) until 01 is displayed in the Ball In Play/ Match display.

Press the pinball Start button (or number 1 on pc keyboard) to reach the desired points, (240000). It raises 10.000 points every time 1 is pressed.

Then press 7 again, and 02 will be desplayed in the Ball In Play/ Match display.

Press the 1 key or the cabinet start button to reach the desired points, (500.000).

 

Then press 7 key until the machine resets itself and goes to attract mode.

 

Insert coins and have fun 

 

This procedure is valid for all SS 80s Bally and Stern games.

 

NOW, you have an almost real SMDM at home! havent you?? 

 

Playcade.

 

PS: SMDM 2.0 can be downloaded without changes from here:

http://www.vpforums....&showfile=11355

 

Then try the changes.

Edited by playcade, 02 April 2016 - 05:02 PM.

[Carny_Priest]

 

FP looks great, but has Saturn´s physics... VP is the best! And now, VPX rocks!!!!

 

But sometimes, good authors put bad physics values on VPX tables...I dont know why, perhaps because the dont own or dont play real pins to compare real ball behavior.

I have 5 real pins (old 80s pins) and play dayly, so can compare VPX to real life...

So, I made some changes in a VPX table.

Goodlooking tables need some physics changes.

I modified SMDM , by ALLKNOWING2012  (I cant stop playing that table now...I´m sick!!!!)

 

Here I go:

 

Getting Better the physics of SMDM 2.0:

Try 3 coins with the actual parameters, and then with these changes, and then you tell me.....

 

Table slope: change from 6 to 5,5

Gates elasticity: change from 0,6 to 0,9 .-  This will allow the ball to enter the saucer when start a new ball, like the real table, (watch youtube videos)

Bumpers Force: change  from 7 to 8,5

Slingshot Force: change from 0 to 2,9

Top Saucer force: Change from 5 to 15 open the SCRIPTS, line 144, change the last number (5) to 15 to increase the saucer power when release the ball.

 

The table behavior will be almost the same as the real pinball machine.

It took me 3 hours of investigations (and COINS) to get this working properly, in my opinion!

 

Thanks to the table author allknowing2012!!!!

 

You will remove FP from your cab  (as I did!)

 

Then do this, if you like to play for the replays:

 

How to set up FIRST REPLAY (240.000 pts) and SECOND REPLAY (500.000pts) according to the INSTRUCTIONS and REPLAYS CARDS:

 

Press the number 7 six times (pc keyboard) until 01 is displayed in the Ball In Play/ Match display.

Press the pinball Start button (or number 1 on pc keyboard) to reach the desired points, (240000). It raises 10.000 points every time 1 is pressed.

Then press 7 again, and 02 will be desplayed in the Ball In Play/ Match display.

Press the 1 key or the cabinet start button to reach the desired points, (500.000).

 

Then press 7 key until the machine resets itself and goes to attract mode.

 

Insert coins and have fun 

 

This procedure is valid for all SS 80s Bally and Stern games.

 

NOW, you have an almost real SMDM at home! havent you?? 

 

Playcade.

 

PS: SMDM 2.0 can be downloaded without changes from here:

http://www.vpforums....&showfile=11355

 

Then try the changes.

 

 

Thanks, I'll give this a try. You probably should repost this in the SMDM support thread so others can find your settings.

[playcade]

Yes, I did! In fact, I posted this first there, and then copied and pasted it here.

Edited by playcade, 31 March 2016 - 11:22 PM.

[hauntfreaks]

speaking of SMDM... heres my reworked lighting.... Playcade, thanks for the awesome settings

 

Edited by hauntfreaks, 31 March 2016 - 11:50 PM.

[Ben Logan]

Hauntfreaks - you are leading the charge with VP10 lighting. Super cool looking.

Regarding FP -- I really liked Pincade's FP 2.0 project. Hope he picks that back up. I thought he vastly improved ball physics. He was working on more consistency in flipper physics (aiming) too.

Edited by Ben Logan, 01 April 2016 - 12:24 AM.

[playcade]

Is it possible to create a pinball emulator with the best features of FP (graphycs) and the best of VP (physics and rom support) ??

[Carny_Priest]

What? VPX doesn't do it for you?

[hauntfreaks]

one thing i wish VPX had that FP does is the manual camera.... so you could go in and see if things are correctly positioned and testing

[Ben Logan]

Is it possible to create a pinball emulator with the best features of FP (graphycs) and the best of VP (physics and rom support) ??

Check out Unit3d pinball.