2969 replies to this topic

[slam23]

Slam23,
With respect to such VP tables high highscores tables I'm sure this is caused by bad physics adjustments in some tables (I know what tables are, but I will not name them and also not name the authors to avoid controversy).
There's no table with perfect physics. But there are tables very close to the real physics and real difficulties. It may seem an exaggeration and know it is... but sometimes I feel the same emotion as playing a real pin when playing a table with great physics adjustment.
Ahhh... about that your link above "piball highscores (real pins)"... I don't know if I can trust in that. You commented about Scared Stiff... well, checking the SS real pin highscore I see first place: ZAC - 986,621,170 - scored in 20 June 2003 and posted in 20 Jun 2005. But in Guinness book 2006 Scared Stiff highscore appears: 69,895,370 Craig Sengstock (SS highscore).
Anyway Scared Stiff, one of my favorites and I play it in real life, is a good example for VP physics... JP's VP8 version is still better than VP9 version in physics, much more realistic despite VP9 physics improvements.
Sorry my terrible english
Regards,
Billy

EDITED:
Interesting I found in that site... Real pins? Are you sure? Look the picture about this Medieval madness score: 645.390.660 - KER ............ LINKs: page
picture

I'm with you on some tables that don't have realistic physics or quirky angles from flippers. JP himself says that his recreations are not meant to be literal interpretations of the real tables, but fun and fast adaptations. That said, I still think he gets very near the original tables. So the point is, even real pins can differ extensively because of particular operator settings, maintenance, level etc. Then VP tables differ widely in realism and can be very different from their real pin counterparts. That said, I think some of the people at this forum (especially Bolt, Android, Ripleyyy, Sabat, TA 2686 and 1234fd (sure I'm forgetting some people)) have great skill, comparable to top real pin players but with respect to VP playing offcourse. I would love to see some of them compete head to head on a VP pin cab with a player on the same real table. Crossplatform competition so to speak.
I must say that's the first time I have seen a VP HS on that pinballhighscores site, maybe they allow those scores? I couldn't find any FAQ or list with requirements to post there but sure interesting to see VP creeping in. Maybe I will go post there also
The VP8 version of SS was too easy IMHO, I could score Jackpot after Jackpot when the Crate released the balls to the left flipper. I believe JP now built in more randomness in the latest VP9 version. I don't have experience myself with SS but I heard from several people in the VP8 release thread for SS that the real pin was definitely more difficult in comparison to the VP version. But I'll take your word for it, you have after all the real thing!
Slam23

[RipleYYY]

ROLLER DISCO
VP9 last
994.700 (tilted on last ball - pay attention, the BONUS collect is fast... )
MIC

[RipleYYY]

ROYAL FLUSH
VP9 last
3.288.850 (forget it !!! even if im "quite" sure i was on that 3M points zone)
EDIT : still got probs with the digits on the 3 "RF" pins, seems OK on the last 9.12 DELUXE version just updated, than will compete on that one
MIC

Edited by RipleYYY, 28 April 2011 - 09:57 AM.

[RipleYYY]

i'll quit with this one than, its time to go to work
good games/luck all
++

ROYAL FLUSH DELUXE
VP9 9.12
2.488.790
MIC

[billyrjse]

Slam23,
With respect to such VP tables high highscores tables I'm sure this is caused by bad physics adjustments in some tables (I know what tables are, but I will not name them and also not name the authors to avoid controversy).
There's no table with perfect physics. But there are tables very close to the real physics and real difficulties. It may seem an exaggeration and know it is... but sometimes I feel the same emotion as playing a real pin when playing a table with great physics adjustment.
Ahhh... about that your link above "piball highscores (real pins)"... I don't know if I can trust in that. You commented about Scared Stiff... well, checking the SS real pin highscore I see first place: ZAC - 986,621,170 - scored in 20 June 2003 and posted in 20 Jun 2005. But in Guinness book 2006 Scared Stiff highscore appears: 69,895,370 Craig Sengstock (SS highscore).
Anyway Scared Stiff, one of my favorites and I play it in real life, is a good example for VP physics... JP's VP8 version is still better than VP9 version in physics, much more realistic despite VP9 physics improvements.
Sorry my terrible english
Regards,
Billy

EDITED:
Interesting I found in that site... Real pins? Are you sure? Look the picture about this Medieval madness score: 645.390.660 - KER ............ LINKs: page
picture

I'm with you on some tables that don't have realistic physics or quirky angles from flippers. JP himself says that his recreations are not meant to be literal interpretations of the real tables, but fun and fast adaptations. That said, I still think he gets very near the original tables. So the point is, even real pins can differ extensively because of particular operator settings, maintenance, level etc. Then VP tables differ widely in realism and can be very different from their real pin counterparts. That said, I think some of the people at this forum (especially Bolt, Android, Ripleyyy, Sabat, TA 2686 and 1234fd (sure I'm forgetting some people)) have great skill, comparable to top real pin players but with respect to VP playing offcourse. I would love to see some of them compete head to head on a VP pin cab with a player on the same real table. Crossplatform competition so to speak.
I must say that's the first time I have seen a VP HS on that pinballhighscores site, maybe they allow those scores? I couldn't find any FAQ or list with requirements to post there but sure interesting to see VP creeping in. Maybe I will go post there also
The VP8 version of SS was too easy IMHO, I could score Jackpot after Jackpot when the Crate released the balls to the left flipper. I believe JP now built in more randomness in the latest VP9 version. I don't have experience myself with SS but I heard from several people in the VP8 release thread for SS that the real pin was definitely more difficult in comparison to the VP version. But I'll take your word for it, you have after all the real thing!
Slam23

Hi Slam23!
I attend a pinball club here in Rio (Real pins, for sure! ) There are almost 100 real pin machines. Here is the paradise... Paradise
I guarantee that anyone who plays a real pin machine and then play some JP's VP tables clearly notice great differences about physics and also assure that many that want try to score a billion points unfortunately won't do because it's necessary ability to play real pinball to score high points. In the VP It is possible in some poorly calibrated table . But if really JP said that above... What's to do? He is the author. In real pins you must control the ball and knows where you aim to score high and get. I ​​am very reasonable player, but I see guys really good and skilled playing. I watch their games and I know how hard it is even for skilled guys. I bet that many people don't see a machine since your childhood or adolescence (this was my case), I played the VP tables and was also score billion points years ago without a parameter, since a long time ago I played a real pin (my VP record was Scapino's CFBL - How easy).
Until a day that a friend invited me to meet his pinball club in 2008 and then I could remember how was playing in it in real life. From there I began to notice that there are many physics differences between real pins and some VP tables. Some authors have a good knowlegde about physics and others not. Well, I'm only trying to help.
The Scared Stiff VP8 I refer, I'm sure you're confusing the files. I refer to "ScaredStiffPrototype1.06_vp8". This is VP8 version is better in physics than this latest VP9 version. Even during this crate release of balls falling into the left fliper that you refer happens in VP9 version, NOT in VP8 version. This VP8 version has Not strong flippers, its hard to aim ramps, more ramdom when ball is released by kicker after crate. If this VP8 table haven't a ball problem crossing flippers during the game, I would continue playing this SS VP8 table until today.
I will stop here with my beliefs. And each one with your beliefs and tastes.
Let's play pinball.
Cheers, Billy.

Edited by billyrjse, 28 April 2011 - 03:53 PM.

[slam23]

Hi Slam23!
I attend a pinball club here in Rio (Real pins, for sure! ) There are almost 100 real pin machines. Here is the paradise... Paradise
I guarantee that anyone who plays a real pin machine and then play some JP's VP tables clearly notice great differences about physics and also assure that many that want try to score a billion points unfortunately won't do because it's necessary ability to play real pinball to score high points. In the VP It is possible in some poorly calibrated table . But if really JP said that above... What's to do? He is the author. In real pins you must control the ball and knows where you aim to score high and get. I ​​am very reasonable player, but I see guys really good and skilled playing. I watch their games and I know how hard it is even for skilled guys. I bet that many people don't see a machine since your childhood or adolescence (this was my case), I played the VP tables and was also score billion points years ago without a parameter, since a long time ago I played a real pin (my VP record was Scapino's CFBL - How easy).
Until a day that a friend invited me to meet his pinball club in 2008 and then I could remember how was playing in it in real life. From there I began to notice that there are many physics differences between real pins and some VP tables. Some authors have a good knowlegde about physics and others not. Well, I'm only trying to help.
The Scared Stiff VP8 I refer, I'm sure you're confusing the files. I refer to "ScaredStiffPrototype1.06_vp8". This is VP8 version is better in physics than this latest VP9 version. Even during this crate release of balls falling into the left fliper that you refer happens in VP9 version, NOT in VP8 version. This VP8 version has Not strong flippers, its hard to aim ramps, more ramdom when ball is released by kicker after crate. If this VP8 table haven't a ball problem crossing flippers during the game, I would continue playing this SS VP8 table until today.
I will stop here with my beliefs. And each one with your beliefs and tastes.
Let's play pinball.
Cheers, Billy.

Now you are just making me jealous!! That looks like an impressive collection, I wish something like this would exist in Holland where I live. Do you play there often? You would have an excellent opportunity to take pictures and video when the tables are opened for maintenance, or is that done behind closed doors? Well, just an idea....I must say for me it's a long while ago that I extensively played pins, so I have to compare tables from memory. I would probably search for the shift keys on a real pin before I find the buttons....
You are right about Scared Stiff, I refer to the VP9 table where the ball is fed from the crate to the flippers. I remember the ball through the flippers bug....I would scream at my screen when that would happen right when I was scoring big on LOTR VP8.....Glad VP9 has fixed that, can't wait to see where the devs will come up with next.
Enough of the talk, let's go play again!
Thanks Billy for the nice discussion,
Slam23

[RipleYYY]

now, i wanna go to BRAZIL !!!

[billyrjse]

Hi Slam23!
Well, the pinball club owner is a friend. He joined many friends, actually are 25 partners where each one brings their pinball machines from their home and puts to the club. For those who are partners have free access pass any day and any time. I've heard that one friend had a breakup with his wife... so, he slept there among the pin machines nothing better to cure the heartache.
Despite only 15 minutes from my house to get the club I usually go there whenever I can, usually in the championships as a guest. When I'm playing there I play all day long. To become a partner/member you must have a machine at the club and pay a monthly fee for maintenance of machines and rental of property. I was invited to be partner, but my time is too short to go there frequently and didnt have a pinball machine, yet. All pin machines at the club are 100% working and configured in Free Play. Besides that, I still play a MM and a NGG at a mall in front of my house. Moreover, any mall here has at least two pin machines and there are many malls in the city . Also there are another pinball club like that in São Paulo, another city from Brasil... and many malls too... so many, many, many pins .
My dream is to buy a real pin and set up my game room. But here, the machines are very expensive and I'm waiting for the opportunity to buy one.
The pin repairs are made right there. Yes, I can take pictures, but requires that some pin is disassembled for repair... sometimes there are many. I already asked about it cause I intend to recreate a VP brazilian taito.


@RipleYYY: Welcome!!!

[RipleYYY]

aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaargh tanx but but & but...

(one day who knows !?)

[RipleYYY]

a first "good "score, lets wait for more

RADICAL
VP9 hot hot hot
44.485.540
MIC



(and bravo to the master for the release of course)

[slam23]

Wow! Who knew that Brasil would be pinball heaven! In my town it was almost 20 years ago that every bar had one or two pinball machines. Now only some coffee shops have them, mostly poorly maintained and definitely no fun to play. Many times I almost offered to take the poor machines with me back home, but I don't have room for them....
Nice idea, how the club thing is set up to work. That story about the guy who slept between the pins is sad but also very funny. Maybe Elvira would wake up that "sleepy head"....
Well, back to business, I started playing AFM FS by JPSalas, but it looks like something is amiss with multiball instances. I guess I'll wait for a fix for that before getting too seriously involved.
Slam23

Hi Slam23!
Well, the pinball club owner is a friend. He joined many friends, actually are 25 partners where each one brings their pinball machines from their home and puts to the club. For those who are partners have free access pass any day and any time. I've heard that one friend had a breakup with his wife... so, he slept there among the pin machines nothing better to cure the heartache.
Despite only 15 minutes from my house to get the club I usually go there whenever I can, usually in the championships as a guest. When I'm playing there I play all day long. To become a partner/member you must have a machine at the club and pay a monthly fee for maintenance of machines and rental of property. I was invited to be partner, but my time is too short to go there frequently and didnt have a pinball machine, yet. All pin machines at the club are 100% working and configured in Free Play. Besides that, I still play a MM and a NGG at a mall in front of my house. Moreover, any mall here has at least two pin machines and there are many malls in the city . Also there are another pinball club like that in São Paulo, another city from Brasil... and many malls too... so many, many, many pins .
My dream is to buy a real pin and set up my game room. But here, the machines are very expensive and I'm waiting for the opportunity to buy one.
The pin repairs are made right there. Yes, I can take pictures, but requires that some pin is disassembled for repair... sometimes there are many. I already asked about it cause I intend to recreate a VP brazilian taito.


@RipleYYY: Welcome!!!

[ANDROID]

Hey all!!!
Great responses on the playability of VP8 vs VP9, nudging, FS vs 4:3, and comparing vp/vpm tables vs real tables.

Every vpm table is different in nudging and flipper settings. I respect all the authors and the time consumed in getting these gorgeous looking tables for us avid players.

FS vs 4:3: I think that most good players have to be able to see the whole table in one view with mininal shifting of the eyes, like I believe Slam was saying, as you lose the geometric line the ball is taking towards the flipper. When I play a real machine, or if I ever get to play a vpm FS on a 37-42" monitor, I normally crouch down by staggering on leg ahead of the other and creating a wider base. I am 6'0" tall, but I generally like to play at 30-45 degrees above horizontal. If I were playing a FS vpm table I would like to see the objects rendered at that angle, which I think is allowable when authors are saying there tables are angle independant. right? I think that it would look weird if it were just a top down view. So I agree with those that dont like it that way.

VP8 vs VP9: There is no question that I like the bounciness of VP9 and some of the ways the ball reacts around the flipper. I don't like the nudging, because it has become too easy IMHO to move the ball away from a SDTM drain.
Not that I don't like High Scores!! . I think that the nudging should be toned down for the 4:3 users, if it is a scale of 1-10 nudging stength, then a 2 or so. I can't vouch for how the nudging works for the FS users who have the PW program in use. I understand in real pinball you can slide a table sometimes a long ways and, depending on the tilt mechanism and setup, be able to nudge quit a bit, while others, like the brand new Avatar, I am tilting it all the time just holding on to the machine!

VPM/VP vs Real tables: Of course, everyone would agree that if you could play the real table, in good condition, you would over a vpm table. Nothing beats the real thing. Thanks to Studmuff I have had the priviledge to play 15 all time classics at his house a few times a year(MM, IJ93, SM, Ava, IM, LOTR, TZ, TAF, CV, SS, WW, FG & all) as well as the 6 pins at Martys studio. However thats not possible for most. I do like the way some players have been adjusting there flippers, slingshots, and bumpers to recreate a real table, especially those players who have access to, or have owned the real table, and have adjusted the flipper settings to closely mimic the real thing. I after playing Noah and UR,s table Terminator 2 there isn't much I don't like about it. They have nailed some of the flipper settings IMHO. Unfortunately, not all tables have been recreated that closely PHYSICS wise.
I think those that have tried T2, will agree it is a tough table to get great high scores. I have seen were players have shared more realistic( like the real table) flipper settings and shared them with others, but IMO we need to get a list of tables and settings closer to the real thing. I know this goes against all my High Score opinions in the past about playing tables as is etc etc. These would become MOD's I guess. I am terrible with the editor, so I am not one to mess with settings very often. For this HS thread, we have always played the table as is. I would love to see a thread started by those tinkerers, play testers, and HS acheivers who have found more realistic physics settings for the flippers, slings, bumpers, and nudging, for the top tables. I know I have seen people here and there list there favorite settings. I used to ignore those, because I wanted to see if I could get a HS as is. But if its more realistic I think we all would enjoy that even more! So I agree with the poster who mentioned that as well.

Thanks to all for their input/opinions. I am sorry I made this post so long, but I have raised a few more questions, and if anyone has better settings than the authors have used, I think we all would love to check them out. I know that I would copy my existing tables and add a MFP after the table name for Modded For Physics: just to test them out. MFP mudda friggin perfect.

RipleYYY: Will update your missing BK score, and beat your BTTF again, soon!!! HEHE!!

UPDATES IN A COUPLE DAYS!!!

Peace Andy

Edited by ANDROID, 29 April 2011 - 07:06 PM.

[slam23]

Hi Android,

I have just finished a nice game of AFM FS (9.12, v2.3 JP), in time for the update to the HS lists! I beat my own previous GC mark of 125 B (which was on an earlier 4:3 VP9 version) by a cool 75B+ to reach:

--> 209.178.418.970 (JOR) <--

I had 3 re-elections ROTU, some really nice TA's (in all about 10 I would guess) and I was scoring big on victory laps too, saw one of 410M come by. I still don't really aim to maximize those but I probably made some nice combo's anyway to reach that (rulesheet says they max out at 500M). I had my extra balls at 10 and 40 Stroke of Luck's and second saucer destroyed. I also got 2 EB's from the video mode and had a direct one lit from a Stroke of Luck. Messed up Strobe Multiball though for an easy EB. And as usual I forgot about my Martian Bombs (though I didn't actually need those, except when playing video mode). I really like AFM but where scoring big on LOTR was feeling like a conquest, especially to finally reach Valinor multiball, AFM is just plain silly fun. I do miss a deep ruleset on this one (a wizard mode for example a step up from ROTU, with some hard requirements) to keep interested for a longer time. It does get repetitive. The only thing I would still like to know is what happens when you hit your 30th TA, GRONI once suggested that something special would happen, I'll try to find that post again here somewhere. Well, back to playing!

Slam23

PS: I just saw I missed YLB's score by 2B (he had 211B), damn that was close! His version was different though, but I'm still bummed out a bit.....

Attached Files

•  AFM_JP_2.3FS_GC_209178418970.jpg   926.62KB   5 downloads

Edited by slam23, 29 April 2011 - 09:02 PM.

[billyrjse]

@Android: Long but great post (IMHO).
If this was allowed... Like graphics or view ​​mods are allowed with the author permission... I would appreciate to see some "physics mods" for some tables... Just physics, nothing more (flippers, elasticity, force, rubbers, walls, etc, etc). The goal would be to making some tables more real in gameplay.
Well, I guess it does not change the artistic side of the table, only the gameplay... I don't know... maybe it's possible...
Mods made by authors that knows better about physics (IMHO) as UR/Noah, Groni, UW, Kruge99 and Rawd for example. Could there be a vote ... maybe...
Well, it's just an idea

[slam23]

@Billy & Android: I know JP for example has often stated that we are meant to feel free to adjust the physics to our taste for personal use. It's another thing to upload a mod, even if it's just physics settings that have been altered. I know that Groni once got into trouble when he modded one of JP's tables in such a way (I believe it was CV but I'm not sure), although he meant well by it. Anyway, although I'm all for getting the VP tables as close to real as possible, I think that would not come across as the "right" thing to do. Maybe some authors are open to physics suggestions and would like to work with us to adjust a table and upload a new version. I know there are some authors that have asked for input from real pin owners and/or dedicated table testers. But we can ask Noah about this and test the "waters" as it were? In the mean time I think we should play the tables as they are provided, only then we can compare highscores. The system we have in place now (with only providing screen shots) already asks for a lot of trust in each other that we don't adjust things to ameliorate our scores. Also I think with at least 2 different versions coming out for every table (4:3 and FS at minimum) not counting different author versions also, we shouldn't make the situation even more complex by uploading different physics mods of each and every table.

@Android: it may have been a while that I played VP8, but I often find VP9 nudging less exagerrated, the problem now is that authors can change nudge and tilt settings for every individual table whereas in VP8 there was a global setting? Nudging in LOTR was a bit on the liberal side, but AFM is quite strict and not all balls can be saved from SDTM. Also, in VP8 a lot of tables had "floating" ball physics that broke immersion but also slowed play down and made nudging easier.

For the record: if anybody is gonna mention again the ease with which they have access to real pins I'm gonna scream and not talk to you guys anymore, there is a limit to what a guy can take who is sadly deprived of real pinball in his life and has therefore retreated to cyberspace for his pin fix......

Now I'm off going to sleep, it's past my bedtime (again) and the missus is missing me
Slam23

[ta2686]

@Billy & Android: I know JP for example has often stated that we are meant to feel free to adjust the physics to our taste for personal use. It's another thing to upload a mod, even if it's just physics settings that have been altered. I know that Groni once got into trouble when he modded one of JP's tables in such a way (I believe it was CV but I'm not sure), although he meant well by it. Anyway, although I'm all for getting the VP tables as close to real as possible, I think that would not come across as the "right" thing to do. Maybe some authors are open to physics suggestions and would like to work with us to adjust a table and upload a new version. I know there are some authors that have asked for input from real pin owners and/or dedicated table testers. But we can ask Noah about this and test the "waters" as it were? In the mean time I think we should play the tables as they are provided, only then we can compare highscores. The system we have in place now (with only providing screen shots) already asks for a lot of trust in each other that we don't adjust things to ameliorate our scores. Also I think with at least 2 different versions coming out for every table (4:3 and FS at minimum) not counting different author versions also, we shouldn't make the situation even more complex by uploading different physics mods of each and every table.

Slam-

In this issue, I would think it would still be considered a mod that would have to be approved by the original author before it could be uploaded. Now, if the author and players worked together to improve the table and the author released the improved version then I would not have a problem with it, and neither would Noah. However, the protocol that has been established should still hold....no modifications to be released unless approved by the original authors.

[ANDROID]

To all concerned: I guess I did not make myself clear enough. What I was suggesting is that those people familiar with the real machines and their physics create a list of settings only. Not release a mod with the new settings. , That way we could keep the original and make our own adjusted settings version/mod. NOT to release these versions, but to discuss the different settings for each table, and come to a reasonable conclusion, if that is possible. I know of others that have just listed what they have done to the original recreation to make it more realistic to the REAL table.

Just a thread of comprehensive adjustments/ numbers only. I am not sure how to change most of that anyways, so a little help or guideline would be appreciated by those looking for less speed and more realism. I for one know that a short fulcrum shot form the pivot point of a flipper, say less than 1/4 " is NOT going to complete a near side ramp on a real table. I don't mind the speed of the newer VPM tables, certainly a lot of the stern tables have great speed and slope. So I agree with JP's idea of speed adds to the excitement, but some shots and angles are not realistic. thats all.

Is that a little clearer? When JP said you can change his settings, thats what I would like to try, but I would only try it on a copy of his released table, and renaming it MFP or whatever.

Maybe I should dig into it deeper like I did gathering the High Score information. By no means are these adjusted tables or MFP tables, going to be uploaded, or even used to create a High Score. If anything they would probably be harder to get a high score. I know some people have said just changing the slope made it more realistic or slingshot elasticity, or flipper angles, or some of those fancy flipper setttings I am not familiar with.

Wow Slam: 209 BILLION EPIC GAME

Edited by ANDROID, 30 April 2011 - 07:43 AM.

[slam23]

Hi Android and ta2686,

Now I understand, I think that's a great idea! Without access to real tables I can't be of much help I'm afraid. And to recall from memory from 15-20 years back is tricky at best. But I'll follow the discussions with great interest.
Thanks for the compliment Android, that was a big game on AFM. I still feel there's room for improvement though, but with a week Barcelona coming up, I'll have to take a break. Let's see if there are real pins in Barcelona somewhere!
Slam23

[billyrjse]

Perfect, Android.
Just remember to adjust the table physics is not a "cake recipe". Is necessary to change the field values of ​​Table Physics (table slope, global Difficult, etc.) and Backdrop Items (Inc / fov, gravity constant, etc.). But It's more complex... is necessary to observe the behavior of the ball in a real table and compare to VP to also adjust the physics (elasticity, force, speed, etc) of the table objects like flippers, walls, Rubbers, bumpers, pins, etc... anything on the ball can collide. Even if you can't see/play the real pin physically, you can get a good notion watching the youtube videos. There is no quick table, gravity is the same in the USA and here in Brasil and in Holland, and the ball is made of steel in the USA, Brasil and Holland. What there are... new parts and worn parts. I once played an AFM where the slingshots turns the balls gun bullets (hardly to see the ball when bounces on slingshots... constant outlanes). Another AFM that I played with slingshots without maintenance (slower ball bounces). Another case... I played a MM that had the right flipper stronger than the left, could not complete the damsel ramps (the right solenoid was newer and left was older). In short, things of the real pin machines. (Sorry again, Slam... I'm talking about my experiences in real pin. But, you will have yours in Barcelona).
I see many people commenting that some VP pins are fast like a kind of real pin. It is NOT true, the balls falls at the same speed on any machine. What exists is the natural difficulty from machine to machine and of course the habit to play it too. Even if we change a little the slope, this speed variation will not be like a rocket as we can see in some JP tables. The majority of JP tables there are STRONG flippers and sometimes also misaligned (wrong angles to aim). In many tables I can't stop at least two balls on the same flipper during multiball... exchange ball between flipers and launch only one ball... or any kind of flipper passes... do this is very important.
Please, folks, I am not the owner of the truth... I'm just giving my testimony that who plays on real pins and I am constantly in the middle of great players. Honestly, I think surreal, a VP table freshly released and someone score 44M or 209B. I do not doubt the ability of the players... but I think there is something too easy to score those points even in VP tables, and I'm sure that is NOT the HYPER SPEED of the table that makes the table more challenging, but YES... the ball random movements allied to a good flippers calibration as we can see in many other VP tables.

@ Slam23: When you have the opportunity of playing in Barcelona, ​​then please tell us your experience.

Sorry my poor english
Greetings,
Billy.

Edited by billyrjse, 30 April 2011 - 10:14 PM.

[ta2686]

Not much of a high score, but I wanted to post something to get you guys started!

Radical!
JPSalas/Grizz/Hassanchop
VP9.12
Version 1.0.1
12,126,110
TOM



The only thing I hate about this table is the soundtrack! Way too gnarly for me! And that repetitious SKATE OR DIE! Makes me want to turn off my speakers while I'm playing the game, but then I'd miss the important sounds in the game, like GO FOR MEGA_MILLIONS! (Yeah right. 7 million is mega millions????)