3889 replies to this topic

[randr]

@fuzzel please explain again why mb models look so bad in vp10 and what I should do to fix. Not understanding but yes something is different

As Toxie pointed out earlier, you need to smooth the normals of the meshes. Export them and import the obj files in Blender. Select the mesh and press tab key you're now in edit mode. On the left side you will see a menu like in the screen shot (I'm using Blender 2.71). Click on Smooth Faces,Edges and Vertices and export the mesh again and load it into VP again.

Understood. I'll try it again

[lodger]

I had a quick question regarding the star rollovers- how do you set it so that they do not disappear when they are hit?

[fuzzel]

That has to do with the animation speed. The animation will move the trigger into the playfield if the animation speed is to high it looks like the trigger would disappear

[toxie]

 

@fuzzel please explain again why mb models look so bad in vp10 and what I should do to fix. Not understanding but yes something is different

As Toxie pointed out earlier, you need to smooth the normals of the meshes. Export them and import the obj files in Blender. Select the mesh and press tab key you're now in edit mode. On the left side you will see a menu like in the screen shot (I'm using Blender 2.71). Click on Smooth Faces,Edges and Vertices and export the mesh again and load it into VP again.

 

 

That should do the trick (hopefully). If its still faceted, then give me a shout, as we might have to do some internal changes, too.

[fuzzel]

I checked the meshes and they are really strange. They even look strange in Blender without a texture, with a texture it's hard to tell but the problem is that the mesh itself is somewhat tesselated. I don't think that we can do much against it.

[chepas]

Dont you relate the impression that the ball in the vp10 behaves a bit like rubber ball ? And dont you think the ball stops on the flippers falling from the high speed from left and right side (I know that the ball spins but is not that a bit unnatural ? (Sorry for my english)

 

Yes, a bit. Papa smurf feels like it's a "bouncy rubber ball" especially with the ball texture. Probably not possible, but would be nice to reduce the visual spin so it doesn't look so exaggerated.

 

The settings on the objects need to be set right to reduce the spin , as well as the flippers & table physics. You or anyone could tweak these and export the physics settings and share.

 

A good way is to delete a table script, load a very basic one with "key flippers control" and use the "debug:throw balls in player" to knock the ball around and tweak. I have a spare folder holding various physics settings for each game I'm making.

[toxie]

I checked the meshes and they are really strange. They even look strange in Blender without a texture, with a texture it's hard to tell but the problem is that the mesh itself is somewhat tesselated. I don't think that we can do much against it.

 

I guess the topology was lost on export. Maybe something like this: http://wiki.blender..../Meshes/Cleanup

Or that: http://blender.stack...les-to-one-mesh

(i don't have blender, still a max user )

 

EDIT: and then the smooth stuff afterwards

Edited by toxie, 17 February 2015 - 09:06 PM.

[fuzzel]

So randr here you have your answer I tried it on the mad scientist: go into edit mode, select all faces (A key) and on the left side menu under "Remove" click on "Remove doubles" that should do the trick.

[randr]

Yes that smooths it out very nicely

[toxie]

also some progress on the crashes: by now everything seems to be leak-free, but the damn black frame issue still remains..  :/

[freneticamnesic]

Black screen is undesirable but does not result in loss of data, I call it a draw

[ICPjuggla]

Black screen is undesirable but does not result in loss of data, I call it a draw

I got the black screen and forgot to save. It has locked up the laptop I'm using 3 times now. Had to foce quit everything and restart the pc.

[toxie]

i think i also found the reason for the black screen by now.

at least i couldn't repro the issue anymore so far.

[Arcade4]

Dont you relate the impression that the ball in the vp10 behaves a bit like rubber ball ? And dont you think the ball stops on the flippers falling from the high speed from left and right side (I know that the ball spins but is not that a bit unnatural ? (Sorry for my english)

Yes. Very much so.

I have not brought it up, because I'm sure it will be fixed soon.

But the ball does do some crazy bouncing around especially around the flippers and slings that a real pinball just does not.

[BananaBoat]

 

Dont you relate the impression that the ball in the vp10 behaves a bit like rubber ball ? And dont you think the ball stops on the flippers falling from the high speed from left and right side (I know that the ball spins but is not that a bit unnatural ? (Sorry for my english)

Yes. Very much so.

I have not brought it up, because I'm sure it will be fixed soon.

But the ball does do some crazy bouncing around especially around the flippers and slings that a real pinball just does not.

 

 

yea, its also very noticable in MBash - the ball actually accelerates when it enters the flipper lanes, its almost as though there is no table/ball friction in these areas causing the ball to speed up... anyone else seen this?

[Shockman]

Rubber ball is a good analogy. I'm no expert, but it seems to be by looking with F11 visual aid that the spin is done very well. It's just that this spin translates to direction more that it should. In a perfect world reducing table friction would reduce not the spinning, but the bite. As far as I can tell this is the case. I would also suggest reducing the added value scatter angle and set the constant scatter angle to zero. You can never evaluate physics if you are adding value just for the hell of it. In my opinion the max scatter angle used would be a fraction always less than 1. You will know if you need to use a scatter angle.  

 

 

Dont you relate the impression that the ball in the vp10 behaves a bit like rubber ball ? And dont you think the ball stops on the flippers falling from the high speed from left and right side (I know that the ball spins but is not that a bit unnatural ? (Sorry for my english)

Yes. Very much so.

I have not brought it up, because I'm sure it will be fixed soon.

But the ball does do some crazy bouncing around especially around the flippers and slings that a real pinball just does not.

 

 

yea, its also very noticable in MBash - the ball actually accelerates when it enters the flipper lanes, its almost as though there is no table/ball friction in these areas causing the ball to speed up... anyone else seen this?

 

I noticed it. Last night I looked for a wall to set friction on, but nothing I could find there was at the right height. It seems like the model of the lane guide (blade type between plastic and playfield) is hidden. It's a WIP though. UW will notice it when his attention is on physics.

[freneticamnesic]

 

Black screen is undesirable but does not result in loss of data, I call it a draw

I got the black screen and forgot to save. It has locked up the laptop I'm using 3 times now. Had to foce quit everything and restart the pc.

 

 

weird =[

[Jafjas]

I noticed the accelerating ball also! The ball is speeding up as soon as it gets into the lower part of the lane just in front of the flipper.
It it kind of unpredictable and unnatural.

[Shockman]

I don't know if this will help but I can force that black screen thing by setting compatibility mode to older than XP (Vista). In Windows 8.1 I was able to shut it down using the screen icons in the taskbar after invoking the task manager.

 

I found it trying to fix the behind the white screen thing (the blank VP editor).

Edited by Shockman, 18 February 2015 - 06:21 AM.

[chepas]

What is the ball hitting before entering the lane when it does it? No ones said which lane, or both? Can you change the friction on the guide to see if it helps? Is the transparent top plastic above lane collidable?

 

Use the debug menu to add a ball with the mouse, drop it in from different playfield heights into the lane, adjust , repeat.

 

If I've ever noticed this before in a game it was off the rubbers mostly. It's like a wheel spin a car, where it keeps spinning if stuck and when let loose it flies.

 

Could even be as you're knocking the ball around the momentum is being built up so much and then hits a troublesome object which causes mental spin, but not going to know that unless you drop a ball in rather than whacking it around.

 

UW may appreciate it anyway if you did some of these things and then came back with an answer like "I had to add some friction here because the ball was too fast".

 

PS> turn on the ball dots with F11 first.

Edited by chepas, 18 February 2015 - 06:32 AM.