918 replies to this topic

[ravarcade]

HT w/PS3Eyes = IR-LED tracking with 2 PS3 Eye Toy cams modded to trace ir-led is... complicated.

It require a lot of work.

With hardware: dissasembling 2 cams, replacing 2 optics with ir-light-filter + lenses holder + lens, 5 or 6 ir-leds, battery, wires, some soldering  (You will have to order needed parts from internet). 

With setup in BAM: calibration of every cam optic (this step is optional), calibration set of 2 cams (that cams are used to triangulate ir-led position, setup of screen position in relation to cams...

All that is complicated.It cost more/less same as Kinect. 

At end you will have: better tracking accuracy, very low lag,very very low cpu usage. But among of your work need is 10x more than with Kinect.

 

Back to Kinect problem.

Current state from my perspective: BAM/Kinect plugin can connect to Kinect, but connection is lost quickly.

I googled for your motherboard. I don't think that USB ports on MB is problem. We have to look somewhare else.

 

For to day i have:

1. Try to run Kinect demos from Kinect SDK. Good demo is Kinect fusion. Let me know if some it work or not.

 

2. Possible source of problem: power management. Intel have something called SpeedStep. I allow to change cpu speed based on usage. Here is guide how to turn it off: http://smallbusiness...peed-70828.html

WARNING: Do it cerfuly. By doing it you will not brake computer. It is safe. But at end it may not help and your cpu will run always at full speed. It may result in louder cpu fan work and more heat. So, make sure, that you will be able to revert all changes.

 

Right now i work with Kinect 2 (from XBOX ONE) and i had to install SDK for newer Kinect. I don't know i can build and test Kinect from x360 right now. Anyway, tomorrow i will try to build debug version of Kienct plugin with some logging. This may help me find source of problem. For me it is important to know why Kinect don't work with your computer. Please don't give up with Kinect. It may help to others.

[Baronir2d2]

Rav,

you really are a very good person.

Do you really think and work to help people, thank you.

 

Yes, I will not give up the Kinetc and promise you that we will discover this problem and will post here for others.

 

will disable CPU power control as you suggested, I will turn more to the setup that perhaps might be causing this problem.

 

I will also test with kinect using the SDK.

 

Now, one thing that I find very strange ... in my notebook (Lenovo Thinkpad E430, Intel i5, 4GB) I today installed FP and BAM, I installed my kinect, open the table "Medieval Madness" and the kinect worked normally! !

He opened the cam, found my face with a yellow dotted line, made a brief configuration and the prospect of the table changes as I move!

But the video card from my notebook is very weak and has plenty of leg room, even with the basic settings in the FP is too bad, but the important thing is that it works ....

 

Now is to find out why not work with my computer ...

we in parts, tomorrow will replace the video card. I will use a Geforce 9800GT 1GB 256bit, and I will follow your advice to disable the power control and speed of the cpu.

 

I'll post the results here tomorrow right away.

 

I am a dedicated person, when I go into a project I'm going to the end.

 

thank you.

[ravarcade]

@Baronir2d2

Sorry, i did't manage to find time for "debug-Kinect" plugin for you. 

Good news, i have one more possible test. Try to enable V-Sync in FP video/rendering options or try to run FP not in fullscreen mode.

 

Some details about this:

Now i work with Kinect 2.0. (btw: it work very well). I have found odd behaviour. When i get from FP less than 60 FPS from Kinect i get exacly 30 FPS. But when i get more frames from FP (like 80 FPS) i get a lot less data from Kinect (like 30% of missing frames). This happend only FP runs fullscreen. If i run FP in window i always get 30 FPS from Kincet.

My guess is: If game runs in fullscreen, windows gives high priority to game-rendering threed and ignore other events. So, for me with Kinect 2.0 V-Sync was solution.

[Baronir2d2]

Rav,

I did as you pointed out to me, deactivated all that was unnecessary in the BIOS Phitronics motherboard.

 

The result was exactly the same.

 

below is a test video I made. for a moment the Kinect work, but caught the machine and stopped working again.

 

https://youtu.be/HvDS9H5LaMo

 

soon after I took another mainboard.

Asrock mainboard, AMD A6 treecore processor, 4GB DDR2 and Radeon HD5830 1GB DDR5 256bit.

 

I installed Windows 7 X86, X64 not.

This time I used the original video driver that came in the video card, outdated as it is 2010.

After installing the video I manually installed the client frameworks 4.0 I downloaded from the Microsoft website. Then I installed the SDK 1.7.

 

Now kinect worked perfectly, set up the Kinect Desktop plug-in delay of 100ms, and not used esqueleton, used face detect, got very good result, but the gameplay was a bit strange because the ball game was not fluides, I believe that this point is missing memory and better processor. For the X86 windows no control over 3.2GB.

 

I opened and closed several tables several times and everything worked well with the Kinect !!!

see the link below

 https://youtu.be/HAwjI9k_rX8

 

With that I tried on another HDD reinstall Windows x64 and try to repeat the success we had with the new motherboard and windows x86. I did not get a positive result, with windows x64 kinect up pops my image, but always caught and most times just get the message "Kinect not foud".

 

I realized something ... when getting success was using the original video driver that came in the VGA of the CD. This driver does not install any frameworks version.

 

But when I install windows on x64 I use an updated driver x64 I downloaded from the AMD website. this driver in turn installs a version of frameworks 4.5, I thought that is perhaps having an incompatibility between the drivers and frameworks. . . it will be?

 

I do not know, I'm still deducting what may be the only thing we know right now is that the motherboard Phitronics H55-m did not work in any of my tests.

 

I will continue testing and reporting will advance here, if you see a window in order to solve the problem can post here that I test and comment the results.

 

thank you so much.

Edited by Baronir2d2, 07 December 2015 - 12:38 PM.

[ravarcade]

@baronir2d2

Here is debug build of Kinect plugin:

http://www.ravarcade...ebug/Kinect.dll

Put "Kinect.dll" in BAM/plugins dir (replace old file).

Now when you run FP with BAM and try to use Kinect, BAM will create file "Kinectdbg.log" in same foleder where is loaded table file. (try to "NewTable" from FP menu, so it will be in "Future Pinball" dir.

Please send to me this text file: [email protected]

 

It is only first step in way to find problem source. 

[Baronir2d2]

Ravarcade,

OK!

I sent the file "Kinect Dbg.log" to your mailbox yesterday in the late afternoon.

I did as you asked, replaces Kinect.dll, ran the table "New Table", I tried to run the BAM plugin, but it did not work again.

I hope the file I sent you help us understand why the Kinect does not work on my system with x64.

Yesterday the tests could not detect kinect in any of the tests that I did.

[Baronir2d2]

Ok, at the end of the afternoon I will I will send you back.

 

For information, I'm using for this test:

Windowns 7 x64

Frameworks client 4.0 x86 / x64

SDK 1.7 (not sure if there is difference for x86 and x64, I'm using I downloaded your link).

Old driver radeon (board CD) in 2010.

Mainboard Phitronics H55-M

i3 3,05Ghz

6GB DDR3

Radeon HD5830 1GB DDR5 256bit

Only Kinect and mouse plugged into the rear USB.

A question,

I read somewhere, but do not know how to do and do not know whether to do ....

It is necessary to release or register any DLL in windows for kinect work ???

 

The only thing I do is schedule to run as "administrator" and "Windows XP SP3 compatibility", do it with all .EXE files from the FB directory and BAM.

 

perhaps something to do with it to blame for my failure, right?

Edited by Baronir2d2, 08 December 2015 - 11:15 AM.

[ravarcade]

 

... It is necessary to release or register any DLL in windows for kinect work ???

No. This is work for KinectSDK setup program. You don't need to do anything.

All needed by BAM dlls are loaded from BAM dir. If any needed by BAM dll is missing, then plugin can't be selected (will not be visible in BAM menu).

 

Yesterday i updated Kinect.dll with more debug info.

So please redownload http://www.ravarcade...ebug/Kinect.dll

Run FP with BAM again. It will faill as previous version, but it will write more info in Kinectdbg.log

Please send me that new Kinectdbg.log

 

One more thing to test. Try to run one demo from Kinect SDK. It may be "Kinect Studio".

... or run "Kinect for Windows Developers toolkit" and run "Face Tracking Basic - WPF" (or any other demo).

If it runs, we will know for sure, that Kinect works and SDK is installed correct.

[Baronir2d2]

Rav,

I tried to do the test, I installed kinect development package, ran the Kinect studio application.

It seems that the program does not find the kinect, gets the message below:

 

 

 

I've tried running as administrator, but the result was the same.

I believe that there is a problem with the driver, right?

I do need a specific driver for windows 7 x64?

 

.

.

.

.

Rav,

I entered now in the folder where you installed the kinect tools.

I ran all the .exe files I found in BIN folder.

some open and show my image or just a figure, but at all times and in all the files I tested my image moves for 1 second and then immediately lock.

 

See... 

Just as in the BAM, then I believe that the problem is not with the BAM and not with the FP, but with this kinect 360 drivers for Windows X64.

 

what do you think?

is there any way to solve this case?

Edited by Baronir2d2, 08 December 2015 - 11:22 PM.

[Baronir2d2]

Really!

The USB driver installed in the windows system was a STANDARD!

 

I downloaded the older you sent me and now I have the intel driver h55 host controller installed, I am sure that this was the problem ....

 

I am again installing SDK 1.7 after I uninstalled and rebooted the computer.

 

follows the image of the current driver you asked me. Driver current available on the intel site for H55.

 

 

Edited by Baronir2d2, 09 December 2015 - 12:08 PM.

[ravarcade]

...

what do you think?

is there any way to solve this case?

I have no idea what more we can do.

You already tester with build in windows USB drivers and other drivers from Intel. I don't think, that problem is in USB driver.

 

Here on similiary case Microsoft support advice was to RMA Kinect

https://social.msdn....forum=kinectsdk

 

Here are few similiary problems. With same or different USB controler. On same computer one Kinect work, other not.

https://social.msdn....incompatibility

 

I can't blame USB controler: I have found infos, that some computers with same USB controler works fine with Kinect. (... and some computers not work)

I can't blame Kinect: Your unit work fine with other computer

Same problem exists with different Kinect SDK.

 

Right now i can only adivce to stay with same software and replace some parts (if you have access):

- Power supply. Try different unit

- RAM. Try to run with one memory stick. 2GB is enough to run Kinect tests from SDK.

- replace PS/2 keyboard  with USB keyboard. PS/2 port use some resources, like IRQ. If you stop using this port, OS will split resources different way for other controlers. It may make difference.

- if you can find newer BIOS for motherboard, try to upgrade. In past i have found few times in BIOS change logs for other motherboard infos like "USB compatybility fix".

- if you have access to USB controlers as PCI cards, try one.

[askatu82]

Sorry my bad english, I'm trying to use bam pinball with one ps3eye (I put a second next month). I just made a board calibration with 4 ir led, batteries,... and works fine. But I've a question: For the other ir led track I want to mount in a plastic glasses. I only need one ir led to mount in glasses? Is there a diference if I put 2 or 3 leds on the glasses? Or its enought with one?

Thanks for Bam!

[ravarcade]

Sorry my bad english, I'm trying to use bam pinball with one ps3eye (I put a second next month). I just made a board calibration with 4 ir led, batteries,... and works fine. But I've a question: For the other ir led track I want to mount in a plastic glasses. I only need one ir led to mount in glasses? Is there a diference if I put 2 or 3 leds on the glasses? Or its enought with one?

Thanks for Bam!

Sorry for late answer.

 

If you don't use Stereo3D one led is enough.

BAM don't use ir-tracking same way as TrackIR / FreeTrack. 

BAM uses 2 cams to triangulate position in 3D space for every ir-led. So one is enough for player tracking, buf 4 leds are needed for calibration.

 

If you have 2 leds on glasses edges. BAM will be able to detect head rotation. This will allow to capture position of both eyes.

In other words: with normal 3D TV screen if you rotate head 90 deg 3D feel will lost. It will be "wird" to look at screen. Try it in move theater.

If we capture position for both eyes, we can adjust math for 3D effect and you will not see any differenc when you rotate head. 

BAM Update.

 

http://www.ravarcade...s/bam-setup.exe

http://www.ravarcade...AM_v1.2-114.zip

 

New files: in BAM: "newrenderer.dll",  in BAM/plugins: "Kinect2.dll"

Updated files: "NewLoader.exe", "BAM.dll"

 

New things:

- New player/cam position filtering 

- Kinect 2 is supported

- Fixed FP error: Black text after text color change in  "Table Info" form

- Fixed (almost) FP error: Ball textures when playfield is rotated. (Fix is not 100% perfect, but it looks little beter)

 

-------------- details -----------

New player/cam position filter.

This is realy good stuff. It is soo  good, that i enabled it by default. 

Whole thing has few complicated options to tweak. So to make life easy i have set few "presets" for different head tracking plugins and that settings are aplied automaticly.

In short: In most caeses you will not have to do anything. It will just work.

In case if someone want to go back to old filtering: go to [Config]->[Player tracking], when:

- change "Filtering" from auto to manual (more lines of menu will apear)

- change "mode" to old filter

In time i will put more info on my site.

 

Kinect 2

Needed things to use:

- Kinect 2 (Kinect for XBOX One)

- Adapter Kinect for Windows

- Windows 8 or newer

- USB 3.0 port (... and some USB 3.0 controlers are not supported by Kinect).

 

You will have to install KinectRuntime:

https://download.mic..._1409-Setup.exe

 

Kinect have one "calibration" command. Before you run it make sure, that Kinect see 2/3 or more of playfield screen.

[askatu82]

Thanks for the explanation. I'll try this weekend. Thanks.

[GInsonic]

Hi Ravarcade,

First many thanks for BAM, I can not imagine running FP without it !

Today I installed the new version from December 30, but now FP always crashes after closing the program with this error (Windows 10 x64 Gernan):

Name des fehlerhaften Moduls: renderingengine.dll, Version: 0.0.0.0, Zeitstempel: 0x55fe6f82
Ausnahmecode: 0xc0000005
Fehleroffset: 0x000201aa

Do you have any idea, what could be wrong ?
Everything works flawlessly with the previous BAM from May 2015

Edited by GInsonic, 03 January 2016 - 07:49 PM.

[ravarcade]

... Today I installed the new version from December 30, but now FP always crashes after closing the program with this error (Windows 10 x64 Gernan):

Name des fehlerhaften Moduls: renderingengine.dll, Version: 0.0.0.0, Zeitstempel: 0x55fe6f82
Ausnahmecode: 0xc0000005
Fehleroffset: 0x000201aa

Do you have any idea, what could be wrong ?
Everything works flawlessly with the previous BAM from May 2015

If you get this error like this it is not your foult but my.

I don't get that error on 3 other computers. I have to reproduce it, so i need more info about your computer. 

I need gfx card model and drivers version. 

 

"renderingengine.dll" is my own 3d rendering lib. Currently not used, but some things are still initialized. It is in alpha stage. In future it may be usefull. I spend ~4 months on it and now it is for me hard to remove it.

[Carny_Priest]

FP crashes for me too on exit, no codes though -

 

"A problem cause the program to stop working correctly. Windows will close the program and notify you if a solution is available."

 

plus the ball texture on every table that I have tried is rendered virtually transparent.

 

Windows 10 x64 Home, 8 Gb DDR3 RAM, i5-3570k @ 3.4GHz

NVidia GTX660, Driver 361.43

Running DSR at 3x native resolution (3325 x 1871)

forced arcade mode within BAM (running in a cabinet)

 

I checked for blocked dlls and running fploader and fp as admin

 

Happens on both modded and original FP

Edited by Carny_Priest, 04 January 2016 - 12:03 AM.

[GInsonic]

If you get this error like this it is not your foult but my.
I don't get that error on 3 other computers. I have to reproduce it, so i need more info about your computer. 
I need gfx card model and drivers version. 
 
"renderingengine.dll" is my own 3d rendering lib. Currently not used, but some things are still initialized. It is in alpha stage. In future it may be usefull. I spend ~4 months on it and now it is for me hard to remove it.

Thanks for your answer ! My GFX card is an ASUS NVIDIA GTX 970, driver version 361.43

[Baronir2d2]

So, I will define here some of my steps to be able to help other people with the same problems.

 

With the help of Ravarcade I could understand why my Kinect Xbox 360 came in failure after starting BAM, I will below describe the problem and solution.

My machine at the time the problem was:

Windowns 7 x64

Frameworks client 4.0 x86 / x64

SDK 1.7

Mainboard Phitronics H55-M

i3 3,05Ghz

6GB DDR3

Radeon HD5830 1GB DDR5 256bit and sometimes Geforce 9800GT 256bit

Only Kinect and mouse plugged into the USB rear.

 

The problem is that Kinect plugin is disabled immediately when you open the BAM, "Kinect not present."

This is due to the Intel H55 of my motherboard, this chip is not compatible with Kinect, with me and with others does not.

I changed my motherboard with one that does not have this chipset, actually the new motherboard does not use Intel chipset. Now my Kinect recognizes and works perfectly in every test I did.

Geforce 9800GT VGA notoriously 256B has better performance than the BAM with the ATI HD5830 256B, believe it is driver problem, someone also came to the same conclusion as Nvidia x ATI cards in BAM mode?

 

Now I need a better computer, the new motherboard that I use with a processor is not very good which is not very fast and I'm having problems with LEGS and framerate as the BAM mode is active.

ADM A6 3500 2.1GHz

8GB DDR3

Windowns 7 x64

Frameworks client 4.0 x86 / x64

SDK 1.7

Now, I found a "cat leap" ..... When you set up your Kinect on Windows, make sure you go in the audio menu and disable the microphone kinect as he steals bandwidth of USB. further action is going in the windows control panel, energy, and disable the windows of control over the power supply of the USB ports, so the windows will never turn off the power of the USB ports automatically. For me it all made sense and gave a good result.

 

The errors in FP, I'm also noticing error when closing the tables. Whenever I leave the table FP locks and windows asks to close the program, but I get no error message.

[GInsonic]

The errors in FP, I'm also noticing error when closing the tables. Whenever I leave the table FP locks and windows asks to close the program, but I get no error message.

Just to be clear, I have exactly the same behaviour without a specific error, that Carny_Priest and you describe here, I copied the error message mentioned above from Windows eventlog !

Edited by GInsonic, 04 January 2016 - 12:29 PM.