207 replies to this topic

[rothbauerw]

Nice job WRD and ofcourse Dark for his awesome models. Dark is pumpin them out. He really has the table builders inspired.

No kidding! Dark is a machine!

[wrd1972]

Okay, beta is available in post #1.

No known issues. Everyone play and enjoy and please...please...please post any issues or concerns here.

Edited by wrd1972, 10 October 2016 - 01:00 AM.

[rothbauerw]

Looking really good! Only comment I have so far is the elasticity of the rubber posts seems too high. Or maybe the elasticity falloff needs to be increased. I hit those square a couple of times and the ball comes off them like a rocket.

[Drybonz]

I played the original beta from months ago, and it was really good... I thought with some light tweaking it could have been an official release.

 

Fast forward to the beta wrd just released... wow... this is so amazing.  Dark's helmet and ramps are insane.  I saw the helmet wip shots and thought they were great... wait until you see it in the table.  Lighting is super... everything looks fantastic.

 

Obviously, this is a favorite table for many of us, myself included... and I think this is really just a great tribute to this table.  Thanks to wrd, Dark, Uncle Willy and everyone involved for this little gem.

[RustyCardores]

Internet don't fail me now!

 

UPDATE: LOVE IT!    LOVE IT!    LOVE IT!

 

Thanks so much for this. You guys rock!

Edited by RustyCardores, 10 October 2016 - 04:14 AM.

[dark]

I played the original beta from months ago, and it was really good... I thought with some light tweaking it could have been an official release.

 

Fast forward to the beta wrd just released... wow... this is so amazing.  Dark's helmet and ramps are insane.  I saw the helmet wip shots and thought they were great... wait until you see it in the table.  Lighting is super... everything looks fantastic.

To be clear, I did the ramps back in vp9, flupper re-did the ramps for this version.

[Drybonz]

 

I played the original beta from months ago, and it was really good... I thought with some light tweaking it could have been an official release.

 

Fast forward to the beta wrd just released... wow... this is so amazing.  Dark's helmet and ramps are insane.  I saw the helmet wip shots and thought they were great... wait until you see it in the table.  Lighting is super... everything looks fantastic.

To be clear, I did the ramps back in vp9, flupper re-did the ramps for this version.

 

 

Oops!  Sorry Flupper!  Both of you guys do awesome work.

[Drybonz]

I've had a chance to play this beta for a bit now... as far as beta feedback, and this is really just preference stuff and not problems with the table, so feel free to take with a grain of salt, but I would say the slingshot threshold seems a bit low and also it seems very difficult to get a clean hit on the left ramp that feeds the bride head.  This could be one of those "I suck at pinball" things but was having a lot of trouble getting a clean hit.  Maybe someone else can test for that .

 

Overall, it's great fun and visually very impressive.

[Ben Logan]

Man this has been a knockout last two weeks for VP. So many incredible new tables coming out! With Road Show and BOP especially, it seems like you guys are really learning how to leverage VP physics for unparalleled realism. I know it's an art, because I try to tweak each table to my own idea of what the real table plays like (those I have access to anyway). I can't get anywhere close to what you dev teams have achieved lately in terms of ball and flipper physics realism.

 

All due respect to rothbauerw's comment about elasticity of the posts -- I find them to be really realistic. The real tables I play in my garage and around town have a lot more (often punishing) bounce than many of their VP counterparts. this is one value I often dial up. I especially like that the flipper rubbers are set to 95. Lots of bounce, without any floatiness. Good work!

 

I agree that the posts can rocket the ball down the center drain -- but I like that! I'm no pro by any stretch. but BOP can be kind of "long-playing" if the rubbers are too forgiving.

 

All this said, I think there was some talk in the 10.2 beta thread about introducing a global elasticity setting (?) I'm pretty sure "Playfield Elasticity" field does not effectively control this (?) for those who might want to quickly dial all rubber up or down.

 

A few things I'd like to be able to tweak:

 

- Ball rolling sounds. Can't find the usual line script to dial these up louder. (they're realistic where they are. but I like a little unrealistic exaggeration here).

 

- Ball reflections. I think they look really cool on 95 percent of the table. The one effect I'd maybe like to see turned down is the BOP "demon eyes" effect when you lock balls in eye sockets. I can totally live with it though!

 

- Wire ramp sliding sound. I love the volume at which Knorr and Clark have set there's. I know it's a matter of taste, but it'd be a treat if I could crank this up.

 

Totally small suggestions, all of which can be ignored if you like. This table looks and PLAYS so awesome. What a gift from this amazing team of devs!

Edited by Ben Logan, 10 October 2016 - 04:36 AM.

[robertms]

All due respect to rothbauerw's comment about elasticity of the posts -- I find them to be really realistic. The real tables I play in my garage and around town have a lot more (often punishing) bounce than many of their VP counterparts. this is one value I often dial up. I especially like that the flipper rubbers are set to 95. Lots of bounce, without any floatiness. Good work!

 

I agree that the posts can rocket the ball down the center drain -- but I like that! I'm no pro by any stretch. but BOP can be kind of "long-playing" if the rubbers are too forgiving.

 

I agree with Ben, the snappy gameplay is a welcome change, makes this table more challenging and thus more fun. Great job wrd 

[StevOz]

Finding the beta not desktop render friendly to any changes or adjustments, the cabinet primitives seem to be out of alignment and the whole cabinet sidewalls rendered with far more depth then there should be?

 

 

The red flasher effects also seem to be out of alignment or are out with DT rendering changes?

Edited by StevOz, 10 October 2016 - 08:14 AM.

[sasa12345]

[wrd1972]

Thanks for the replies. I will definitely address the ramp and rolling sounds. And the demon eyes.lol. This occurred at the last minute when I was tweaking on the red mouth light..which I am still not happy with. For some reason, it seems to be shining through the rotating face. How about that tiny helmet lamp flashes on the ball when locked. That happened by accident and is just way cool.

 

On the DT view items. I will see what I can do with the flashers but my first passion is for the FS view. If there are some very particular DT view guys that want to help here with additional features that would enhance DT but not at the expenses of FS, I would welcome it and not mind a bit. Maybe some fancy scripting or so.

 

The one physics concern that has my attention is the hitting of the shuttle ramp. We will see what we can do.

 

Sasa,

Make sure you are running latest 10.2 beta and especially the latest scripts..

Edited by wrd1972, 10 October 2016 - 03:36 PM.

[Rajo Joey]

What a fantastic machine! In the last days, there are so many wonderful tables in VPX coming out and this one belongs to them.

Great artwork, lightning and physics; even this table is more difficult than other versions as VP9 or Pinball Arcade

 

The VPX-version is a challenge.

 

Only the eyes are looking strange. :-) But as I read, you will change this. Also I can live with that eyes.

 Eyes.png   222.01KB   16 downloads

 

[blashyrk]

Looks amazing can't wait to get home from work and try this baby

[wrd1972]

What a fantastic machine! In the last days, there are so many wonderful tables in VPX coming out and this one belongs to them.

Great artwork, lightning and physics; even this table is more difficult than other versions as VP9 or Pinball Arcade

 

The VPX-version is a challenge.

 

Only the eyes are looking strange. :-) But as I read, you will change this. Also I can live with that eyes.

Eyes.png

 

No needing to live with the red eyes. It will be fixed.

[Mark70]

Just tried it, the table looks and plays great.

Ramp shots and everything feels just right.

Thanks for sharing all involved.

[rothbauerw]

I actually like a lot of bounce in my tables too. My comment was really directed towards realism. Watching the PAPA video, the ball definitely decelerates off hard hits to the rubber posts.

Of course I definitely respect the preferences of each individual author and it's up to them on how they want the table to play. I really like the work done on this table and I'm sure it will get many hours of play in my cabinet either way.

Love your work Wrd!

[wrd1972]

Finding the beta not desktop render friendly to any changes or adjustments, the cabinet primitives seem to be out of alignment and the whole cabinet sidewalls rendered with far more depth then there should be?

 

 

The red flasher effects also seem to be out of alignment or are out with DT rendering changes?

The sidewall is easy enough to fix. But please help me better understand the flasher issue.

[dark]

I've had a chance to play this beta for a bit now... as far as beta feedback, and this is really just preference stuff and not problems with the table, so feel free to take with a grain of salt, but I would say the slingshot threshold seems a bit low and also it seems very difficult to get a clean hit on the left ramp that feeds the bride head.  This could be one of those "I suck at pinball" things but was having a lot of trouble getting a clean hit.  Maybe someone else can test for that .

 

Overall, it's great fun and visually very impressive.

 

In the WIP conversation for this build I stated the same opinion, that overall it's pretty good but I feel the flipper vectors are off by a hair.  When I try for the "shuttle ramp" I'm either a fraction of a second too late or too early and when I do think it's right it usually snags the post killing the momentum of the shot.  Back in the physmod5 version (physics tweaked by 85vett who owned the table)  I was able to nail the shuttle ramp with shots that 'felt right" which was key to me getting on the billionaire club score list.  Like I said above, I feel it's only off by a hair,  the timing of the shot and area of the flipper you would think would get it up the ramp just doesn't do it, making it somewhat counter-intuitive.  With the pm5 version I had top scores, with this version I had a really tough time just reaching the first two ball multiball and I played for a good chunk of time.  The posts seem to bounce the ball a little hard but I think the real table does this as well just maybe not quite as much.  I'm not sure about the slings one way or another but they tend to get a hold of the ball and toss it down the out lane drains (this is probably somewhat realistic lol but I don't know, maybe tone it down a bit?).

 

Finding the beta not desktop render friendly to any changes or adjustments, the cabinet primitives seem to be out of alignment and the whole cabinet sidewalls rendered with far more depth then there should be?

 

 

The red flasher effects also seem to be out of alignment or are out with DT rendering changes?

The sidewall is easy enough to fix. But please help me better understand the flasher issue.

 

The red flashers to the sides of the helmet....the flasher object (the light) is too high and could maybe be rotated for DT I think?

 

Also while we're at it I want to make the point that these WIPs need some level of criticism and feedback to be good,  I know a lot of people are a little a scared to offend table authors especially when table authors got really pissed as a whole not long ago over a bunch of drama that we don't need to re-hash.  I think any good table author will agree that so long as users/members put considerable thought and consideration into their critiques and aren't just ranting in a rude fashion about what 'they don't like" then it's only to everyone's benefit.  Of course table authors always reserve the right to include or ignore and said advice.  If everyone is just a "yes-man" around here it will hurt the quality of tables.