109 replies to this topic

[cyberpez]

hehe.. :-)  It actually worked.. 

 

https://www.dropbox....er mod.vpx?dl=0

 

oh... and it was actually this version I had modded..

 

http://www.vpforums....s&showfile=4272

 

Now sure how it would look tiny, but worth a shot...

 

 

Attached Files

•  display.jpg   58.34KB   9 downloads

[lodger]

Cyberpez- send me a PM with your email and I'll show you a table I'm working on that uses that mech. I hope to have some concept stuff to post a bit later

 

btw here is a rough mockup of the display I was talking about earlier- rather than do a real dmd, I was thinking just swapping images on a primitive, etc

Edited by lodger, 10 March 2016 - 02:59 AM.

[lodger]

Cyberpez- With the wizard's hat approach, any thoughts on how we could apply that to an in game object or were you thinking mostly as a DMD sort of object on the table itself?

 

FYI- I am following up on a bit of a revising of the upper right again- I am merging the leftmost lane and the center loop to output the ball via the same exit. This should give a lot more real estate for bumpers and will also make it possible to do the upper as kruge99 said before.

 

This evening I will also use the pen tool in photoshop to trace over the blueprints. To date, these have been thrown together by sight and are a bit sloppy...the pen tool makes for mathematically smooth curves... which  does a lot to smooth out shots, conserve momentum, etc.

[cyberpez]

Sent you a pm..

 

I was thinking we could use the display the same way you were as a mini "dmd" to display messages..  just instead of static they could scroll across, or whatever.  I'm still thinking we could use ultra DMD for an actual dmd..  

[lodger]

Hey all- took a bit of time to work on some of the upper section and its walls. Strangely, it feels like the upper flipper isnt hitting/ making it up the horizontal ramp as consistently...not sure what this is all about. Perhaps someone with better physics chops could take a look at this?

 

Here was my update

https://www.dropbox....-16(2).vpx?dl=0

 

I'm going to have limited time this weekend so I'm ready to tag in someone fresh if they'd like.

 

A few things that we can start to do-

-refine the ramps

- finish putting walls where the wires were to carry the ball

-starting to think of rules/modes

-revising target placement

-Further revisions to the flow of the upper right area

 

I'll be floating around this weekend, let me know if you have any questions

*Tag*

Edited by lodger, 11 March 2016 - 12:37 PM.

[cyberpez]

I played around with the table a bit..  one big change... ..  I moved the lower half down a ways..  I was having a hard time hitting the lower red and white targets..  I don't think I was ever able to hit the white ones...  SO... I moved the slings, flipper, lane guides, and apron all down a ways.  I was then able to shoot the targets on both sides and still seemed able to shoot other shots.  

 

Second..  messed with ramps..  The one right above the upper flipper was low and the ball was hitting it..  So I raised it.  then had to move all the other ramps to accommodate.  Should be able to make all ramp shots now.  The horizontal ramp is still kinda hard to hit but it can be done..  and I'm getting better at it ;-)

 

Third..  played around with the physics..  and by play around I mean set them to JF's default.  (for the most part)

 

Last..  I added my mini display mod above the 4 targets..  Still needs tweaking and there is a bug where not all the animations work right..  but it's there and working for now :-)

 

Here is an link to my version...  I also won't have much time this weekend..  weather is way to nice here to be indoors

 

https://www.dropbox....-11-16.vpx?dl=0

 

 

 

Attached Files

•  meteor2.jpg   141.93KB   10 downloads

[lodger]

Great work and clever usage of the Wizards hat stuff! I'm having some issues with stutter when the display changes though. I'm not sure if its the laptop's gfx card, the new version of vpx (just installed this am), etc.

 

 

I had a few thoughts regarding the plot that might make the game a bit more interesting/might give modes some more meaning.

 

Rather than have the antagonist to the story be a plain old meteor, lets take it into the realm of scifi and actually make it an alien being that is sent by its race to destroy the human world....that manages to get close to the earth by assuming the form of a meteor.

During earlier stages of the game, it seems like a run of the mill meteor and early stages involve the team trying to blow it up...however, after completing the initial modes, it puts out a power field and increasingly takes over the ship, you have to complete modes to win the ship back. after you manage to regain control of the ship, the team uses their skills together to get the meteor to exhaust its telekenetic powers on a single target, allowing the team (using all of their combined skills) to insert a detonator on the alien and destroy it, wizard mode involves escaping the blast.

 

After wizard mode, the rationale for continuing the game is that the team recounts the story to a newspaper writer, modes get enhanced as the characters fib to make themselves and story seem even more incredible yet.

[lodger]

I had an opportunity to brainstorm some graphic and sound stuff-

 

regarding graphics, I was fooling around with some color options- i was thinking maybe pinbot meets attack from mars. I havent added in too much texture stuff yet, but from the mockups i've done (see right) some lighting effects and the color scheme should really stand out and also allows good separation from front and lower playfields.

 

 

One of the thinks that I was thinking for sound was sticking with an FM synthesis style to keep the feel of early 90's arcade. check out the soundtrack for Alien 3 on genesis to get a feel for what i was thinking.

[StevOz]

Looking like a nice design and although I'm not on the team as such have you considered a left outlane kickback option, the layout seems to lend itself to such an option...just 2 cents worth.

[lodger]

steveoz- I think that the kickback is an awesome idea.

 

One of the challenges now will be starting to figure out some basic rules now as this will inform both design, interface, etc. Does anyone have any thoughts on if we have enough to do to accomodate modes? I'm not 100% sure. Any thoughts on modes so far?

 

One idea I was toying around with was whether the mid leftwould benefit from a small upper playfield that would act like either a bagatelle or rollover a la Ripley's BOR

Edited by lodger, 14 March 2016 - 02:53 PM.

[cyberpez]

First off I've not had issues with slowdowns but I'm on the official 10 release.  I've not tried any of the betas, I will give them a try soon though and report back.

 

I can dig the music!!

 

I like the idea of a mini upper playfield too.  You could access it from the kicker way in the back it could up kick to it then drain down the left ramp.

 

I also like the idea of ball saves on the left (maybe right too?)  This seems like a table you are going to want to be able to keep playing for a while to unlock the modes and further your progress.  So the more we can do to keep the ball on the playfield the further you will get.  

 

For the Left you could complete the two drop target.. Complete them again and it increases the kick back bonus.

 

For the right we could do a gate that opens and closes between the two lanes (think Black Hole)  We could move the ramp so it drops into the outlane (bare with me on that)  We could set the gate up in a way so that when you shoot that ramp it would auto open to always save that ball....  for a normal ball save you would need to complete the three drop targets.

 

For a center drain ball save we could do rotating lane lights, complete all 4 lights to enable. 

 

As for modes..  I was thinking on your idea of instead of it just being a meteor..  we could have different "bosses"  We could have say 5 different ones..?  maybe at the beginning of your ball/game you pick your boss..  That could change the lower playfield..  (different part of space) and the boss at the top..  whatever that might be)  On the upper playfields you could do things to increase you chances again the selected boss..  So if the meteor was susceptible to Nukes..  you would have to collect Nukes to increase your damage(certain ramps/drop target banks..  whatever)..  Once you were ready you could raise the ramp (4 red targets?)  then go fight the boss..  You would do more damage depending on your bonus..  we could have hit multiplier lights across the top of the window.. and you could use the mini-display to count down your hit points....  If you defeated the boss and you drained it would save your ball (the right lane gate save I was talking about above)  If you failed no gate save and your ball would drain..  end of ball...  Once you defeated a boss you could move onto the next.  Complete all 5 and you gain wizard mode..  all the same bosses but more powerful.

 

I hope that made sense ;-)

[lodger]

First off I've not had issues with slowdowns but I'm on the official 10 release.  I've not tried any of the betas, I will give them a try soon though and report back.

 

I can dig the music!!

 

I like the idea of a mini upper playfield too.  You could access it from the kicker way in the back it could up kick to it then drain down the left ramp.

 

I also like the idea of ball saves on the left (maybe right too?)  This seems like a table you are going to want to be able to keep playing for a while to unlock the modes and further your progress.  So the more we can do to keep the ball on the playfield the further you will get.  

 

For the Left you could complete the two drop target.. Complete them again and it increases the kick back bonus.

 

For the right we could do a gate that opens and closes between the two lanes (think Black Hole)  We could move the ramp so it drops into the outlane (bare with me on that)  We could set the gate up in a way so that when you shoot that ramp it would auto open to always save that ball....  for a normal ball save you would need to complete the three drop targets.

 

For a center drain ball save we could do rotating lane lights, complete all 4 lights to enable. 

 

As for modes..  I was thinking on your idea of instead of it just being a meteor..  we could have different "bosses"  We could have say 5 different ones..?  maybe at the beginning of your ball/game you pick your boss..  That could change the lower playfield..  (different part of space) and the boss at the top..  whatever that might be)  On the upper playfields you could do things to increase you chances again the selected boss..  So if the meteor was susceptible to Nukes..  you would have to collect Nukes to increase your damage(certain ramps/drop target banks..  whatever)..  Once you were ready you could raise the ramp (4 red targets?)  then go fight the boss..  You would do more damage depending on your bonus..  we could have hit multiplier lights across the top of the window.. and you could use the mini-display to count down your hit points....  If you defeated the boss and you drained it would save your ball (the right lane gate save I was talking about above)  If you failed no gate save and your ball would drain..  end of ball...  Once you defeated a boss you could move onto the next.  Complete all 5 and you gain wizard mode..  all the same bosses but more powerful.

 

I hope that made sense ;-)

makes total sense. perhaps one of the ways we can keep the meteor is that it can be a base/portal to some aliens... take down the alien bosses who have invaded your ship and then perhaps the wizard mode could be to wipe out the meteor. different characters have advantages over other aliens (sort of like the plot to megaman) and you have to unlock heroes by wiping out the alien who has kidnapped that shipmate.

[lodger]

Hey all- I added a few things to the table.

 

Per the earlier post, I added an upper playfield. This is *super temporary and a bit ugly* but it does fit the flow of the table and could be a cool way of adding rollovers/multipliers.

 

I added a few lights as a demo and also added a slingshot to the mid left so that when the ball bounces off the center targets it now hits the slingshot to add some interesting side to side momentum. I also changed the angle of the targets to give a bit more play with the sling.

I also moved the vuk a bit closer to the center because it was having to travel a bit too far around the right loop and could occasionally get locked up.

 

Would anyone care to take a stab at revising the upper playfield/any ideas of what else might work there?

https://www.dropbox....-14-16.vpx?dl=0

[EalaDubhSidhe]

If anyone's wondering; I'm still here and still reading this, but you've all been doing perfectly well without my input this far.

[lodger]

Eala- Thanks so much for your words of affirmation! As always if you have any suggestions, concerns etc please let us know!

 

@Cyberpex- I'm having issues with vp exporting the playfield image you had used when you had made the lower pf- I'd love to be able to thread some of the textures you had used into the design (esp the computer screen and grate texture). Would you be able to post them here as an image?

 

I had a chance to look again at the bagatelle-looking upper and am questioning if the mini bagatelle to rollover is the best solution there. I'm having a hard time getting it to look good/not be too obtrusive and also because there isn't much variation on how/at what speed the ball enters the chamber...it always seems to gravitate toward the one rollover (admittedly, there is really no math to the section, its eyeballed to this point which isn't sufficient other than as a proof of concept). I'm wondering if a 2 lane design might be appropriate w 3 wire rollovers a la Lord of the Rings.

[kruge99]

 

I had a chance to look again at the bagatelle-looking upper and am questioning if the mini bagatelle to rollover is the best solution there. I'm having a hard time getting it to look good/not be too obtrusive and also because there isn't much variation on how/at what speed the ball enters the chamber...it always seems to gravitate toward the one rollover (admittedly, there is really no math to the section, its eyeballed to this point which isn't sufficient other than as a proof of concept). I'm wondering if a 2 lane design might be appropriate w 3 wire rollovers a la Lord of the Rings.

 

I haven't played the latest rev yet but looking at it in the editor I think the layout is fine, maybe it just needs some really bouncy rubbers to give the ball some randomness?

 

 

Best Regards,

Kruge99.

[cyberpez]

Here is a link to a new version of the lower playfield..  Same concept just not quite as quick.

 

https://www.dropbox....m/LPF2.png?dl=0

 

Do you use photoshop?  Here is a link to the psd of the upper playfield I had.  Still has the layers separated out.

 

https://www.dropbox....yfield.psd?dl=0

 

I've adjusted the upper playfield a bit...  I added in Bouncy rubber with a high scatter angle..  things are a bit more random I've hit all three of the roll overs with basic ball drops to the ramp.  I did have to widen and lengthen it a bit to let the balls roll through.. I'll play with it a bit more then post an update.

[cyberpez]

Here is the table back with my tweaks to the upper playfield.  It still seems to favor some rollovers more than others.. but it's a bit better I think... 

 

https://www.dropbox....-15-16.vpx?dl=0

[lodger]

Cyberpez, nice work. The upper pf feels pretty at home on the table and plays a thousand times better. nice work! 

 

I've spotted a few things i'd like to take on this evening after i get a chance:

 

1) the right outlane has been wrecking me. If im going to lose the ball, its going to be there . I'm hoping to try moving the targets/wall around and making that area feel a bit less sadistic.

2) explore options for wire ramp outside of bagatelle/ perhaps having the bagatelle end in the wire ramp that comes in from the right. I'm thinking something like simpsons pinball party upper playfield for how to get the ball out of the upper pf/around the upper pf.

3) will explore some graphics stuff as well. I'm using Photoshop cs2 (a legit version i picked up at Goodwill for a whopping $3.00!)

 

If i get a chance to make updates, I'll post my version later tonight

[lodger]

Cyberpez- i was looking at the lower pf design yesterday and had an idea for how we could get some extra mileage out of the lower pf. we could add channels to the upper left and right that could be combo'ed if the angles were right. Completing the left or right banks in sequence A B and C would turn on a ball lock by hitting the ball into a saucer where the meteor is. We could also have drop targets that raise when there is a mode active that the player would need to knock down to get to the saucer to complete the mode. I've attached a rough drawing (flipped to make it easier to understand.)