74 replies to this topic

[batch]

Very strange topic coming from the past

 

Shockman posted it on 08 January 2015

[ta2686]

Very strange topic coming from the past

 

Shockman posted it on 08 January 2015

This is due to the fact that someone voted in the poll that is attached to this thread.  Even though there hasn't been a post since Shockman's anytime a person votes in the poll it places the thread at the top as if a new post to the thread was made.

[Shockman]

2015 was only the latest round (not really, but it certainly was not an early bout. Correct nudging seems to be taboo. Even after it was done up right in physmod it was tweaked for cabs and crippled for desktop in VPX.

 

As long as these devs are willing to fuck up desktop nudging to tweak cab use of it, instead of seeing (and caring) what they are doing. and look at it as the two functions that it is (digital, and physical) it matters not what is better... vp8 or vp9. We are at VPX now. The ONLY question should be what is better VPX or something else. And the answer is something else (physmod).

 

Maybe next cycle (of devs)

Edited by Shockman, 11 May 2017 - 02:10 AM.

[StevOz]

VPX DT nudging works fine for me then again I've never had those telekinetic powers some claim can make a near frictionless ball change direction/velocity/spin by any significant amount mid table on a near frictionless surface basically defying all the rules of physics that state other wise, via a nudge without tilting, come on show us all the real life video clip that illustrates this phenomena...

Edited by StevOz, 11 May 2017 - 07:00 AM.

[JoeM]

I think Shockman is damned right in this case, Stevoz

[StevOz]

I think Shockman is damned right in this case, Stevoz

 

So you say, maybe, maybe not, show us all the video proof to backup such claims...

Edited by StevOz, 11 May 2017 - 10:56 PM.

[Shockman]

It's the fact that it is nearly frictionless that makes it possible.

 

I think you know that so there may be a miss in communication. The VP9 DT nudging had no recoil, so that might be the action you, 'Oz find unrealistic. It most certainly is for DT use. I passed on the long VP9  run. Updated mmpac, that's it. Tried 2 or three tables max. The nudging physics are why.

 

The action I am talking about, as usual is real machine action vs or simulated by VPX. I'll pass on the VPX run as well if it does not use at least Phymod nudging physics. I personally requested those and Mukstee (sic?) had then up and running within hours, not days. After the bout about what the fuck nudging is, and the physics of it, we finally had nudging as good as it has always been before VP9, and even better, with a global power setting and a nudgetime variable.

 

 

I would fail to appreciate, even a smattering of difference in understanding of what nudging is, and the importance of it's function in of all things, a pinball simulator. Especially from the bunch here. Understand that and you understand my point. There seems to be more than a smattering of folks here. There actually seems to be more here that have no grasp than there is anywhere else. That's damn peculiar. 

Edited by Shockman, 12 May 2017 - 01:19 AM.

[Shockman]

 

I think Shockman is damned right in this case, Stevoz

 

So you say, maybe, maybe not, show us all the video proof to backup such claims...

 

[StevOz]

Nice video Shockman though that was basically a half slap save, a hard nudge is applied to the right side going close to tilting, thus the table and the right flipper moves under the ball whilst the ball does not change it's direction or velocity.

 

Of course to simulate this in FS/cabinet mode then that nudge effect should visually be applied to the ball for that split second and it should appear as the ball does not move at all because the physical table is moving under the ball. When the nudge event is over the ball returns to it's original position, direction and velocity.

 

Basically the visual shake is applied to the table in DT mode vs the visual shake being applied to the ball in cabinet mode.

Edited by StevOz, 12 May 2017 - 08:09 AM.

[gtxjoe]

VPX button nudging using this script

If keycode = LeftTiltKey Then
Nudge 90, 10
End If

Edited by gtxjoe, 13 May 2017 - 01:06 AM.

[gtxjoe]

VPX button nudging using this script and ball moved further to center

If keycode = LeftTiltKey Then
Nudge 90, 25
End If

Edited by gtxjoe, 13 May 2017 - 01:00 AM.

[gtxjoe]

I think this should cause a tilt, but you can do it if you want

If keycode = LeftTiltKey Then
Nudge 90, 65
End If

Edited by gtxjoe, 13 May 2017 - 12:31 AM.

[gtxjoe]

And last but not least... the Death Save Manuever

I am jelly! I can't even do this with my analog nudge device. Button nudge. It just works

If keycode = CenterTiltKey Then
Nudge 0, 12
End If

[BorgDog]

nice testing gtxjoe, looks like desktop nudging works to me.

[Shockman]

It's hard to see what is going on there. Easier to see what is being simulated. The visual shake should have been adjusted for each of the vids.

 

VPX and Physmod uses the same nudging physics, yet a new table in X uses a 2 for strength and physmod that it was developed on uses a default strength of 10. Both use 90 and 270 for side which I don't have a problem with as a default, though the way I side nudge would reflect quite a bit less and more respectively as it more rotation  than straight line movement. It has the same effect and is a lot quicker and easier for me.

 

So as far as I can tell the algorithms could be identical, and only the defaults are different though using the same range and scale. The videos all show you probably agree that 2 is too low, but would remind me that it's a setting to be set at will.

 

It would be easy enough to program a nudge if the damn visual effect was made to match the nudge strength like it use to be.

 

You can program any of those nudges you demonstrated. The biggest problem is in reality you can use all of them and more. Do those accelerometers in your cabs do a good job at allowing all, other than the death save you mentioned?

I think Shockman is damned right in this case, Stevoz

Not in this case.

Edited by Shockman, 13 May 2017 - 07:04 AM.