167 replies to this topic

[wiesshund]

Why not decase the PC and put inside?

Or do you plan to disconnect and use the PC elsewhere as well?

[Tesla]

Why not decase the PC and put inside?

Or do you plan to disconnect and use the PC elsewhere as well?

 

Sure, let's discuss this please.

 

Yes, de-cased it would fit inside, but what is the advantage, other than a slightly cleaner look?

 

I was just thinking the advantages to letting the little Dell Mini-Tower PC just continue to be sitting under-neath the ALP-cabinet.

- Seems to works fine this way.

- The GPU and CPU vent directly to open-air

- Easier to work-on/upgrade PC

- Easier swap-out PC completely for a slightly better one (this one is just Intel-i5/8gb)

 

If it needed to be off the ground, I was even thinking it could be suspended from the bottom in a little hanging PC-tray.

 

I'm just not sure this old PC is the one I want permanently installed inside my nice-cabinet in the year-2023. Don't you think any final-PC installed inside my new-cabinet should be a little newer than 2011?

 

One of my main concerns is heat inside the cabinet. I would rather not have to run a bunch of fans on high just to keep it cool. With the 1/4-in thick glass on top of a heavy wooden-box (filled with LCD-displays and electronic), they always seem to run hot.

Edited by Tesla, 04 November 2023 - 06:42 PM.

[wiesshund]

 

Yes, de-cased it would fit inside, but what is the advantage, other than a slightly cleaner look?

A lot less space

and potentially better cooling as the in a case the PC is now a box inside a box

If putting inside that is

 

Advantage to putting inside?

cleaner look, possibly shorter cables

 

You dont nudge the PC over by mistake.

 

You dont drop the PC bringing it to the cab

 

You should run fans inside the case regardless, to help the LCD disperse heat, since it can no longer rely on convection draft due the LCD laying on its backside

I cannot comment to noise, if i can't hear fans, they are not moving enough air.

I use 48vdc GenCom commercial laser printer fans in my desktop case, they spin fast enough to seriously hurt you and move a huge amount of air and sound like a turbine engine.

I just use a 12v relay to turn them on and off with the PC.

You do want an artificial draft going through the cab though to give the monitor back what you took away by laying it down.

 

Advantage to PC outside cab

PC can do more than just pinball, or things only suitable when standing at a cab

It can also play flight sims, racing sims fps games etc.

Only thing to keep in mind if switching it to different monitor setups is, you may want to keep a bat file handy to purge the windows monitor entries, then you just align the screens real quick and back to pinball

 

*bat file for doing that is

reg delete HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Control\GraphicsDrivers\Configuration
reg delete HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Control\GraphicsDrivers\Connectivity
reg delete HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Control\GraphicsDrivers\ScaleFactors
pause
shutdown /r /t 5

Other advantage to PC outside is, you can use HDD's with 0 worries about mounting them in a manner to avoid shocking the piss out of them while going nudge happy, especially on a small cab where nudging entails driving it around the room..

[Tesla]

Some good points. Ill give it more thought .

Edited by Tesla, 04 November 2023 - 10:12 PM.

[wiesshund]

Some good points. Ill give it more thought .

 

Heat rises

vents in top of monitor let heat go out under its own power

which causes a pressure drop in the case

which causes cool air to be pulled in from the bottom

 

monitor on its back, heat just rizes and pools up on the back of the lcd panel

and under the glass

 

So you force a draft through the cab, which will pull the hot air out of the monitor case

 

can be as simple as a couple quiet fans in front of cab floor sucking air in

a plastic or tin or cardboard for that matter deflector to bend the airflow to go towards the back of the cab

 

Then a couple more quiet fans in the back wall of the cab, or if the design allows it, in the backbox, if the cab design allows for the air to flow freely up into the backbox

which of course gives the advantage to getting heat out of it also

 

A Video arcade cab is it not usually much of an issue

Screens are usually never absolute flat, unless it is a cocktail cab, otherwise they are canted or vertical

PC used, being that it does not need high end GPU's, in fact does not need one at all if you use an APU just needs mostly a CPU cooler of nearly any fashion

And a small low heat powersupply

and the cab itself tends to be a big chimney with everything going up out the top of its own accord

Not a ton of heat generated from a typical MAME cab

[Tesla]

Not sure why, but I always have trouble with initial screenres.txt and .res files.

 

Display #3 looks setup correctly and works properly in Windows, but I can't seem to target the DMD there for any VPX table.

 

I even tried Tom & Jerry and Beavis & Butthead since I understand on these Original tables, the 3rd-screen DMD works as a feature (no ROMs needed).

 

1440 + 1920 = 3360 ... so entry would be

 

3360

0

 

... but it is not working . Display #3 is still completely empty. weird.

Edited by Tesla, 05 November 2023 - 12:39 AM.

[wiesshund]

3361 technically

 

1st question

 

can you drag an object straight to the right? and land on the DMD

[Tesla]

No graphics and DMD screen #3 with this in VPX v7.2:

 

# This is a ScreenRes file for the B2SBackglassServer (v1.3.1.1 or higher) 

# Full-Wide Aspect-Ratio (16:9) Backglass with Full-Screen 3rd-Screen (16:10)

# In Windows, Left-most display is Primary. All 3 Displays are top-aligned

# Playfield Screen resolution width/height (16:9, but Portrait)

1440

2560

# Backglass Screen resolution width/height 

1920

1080

# Backglass Display Devicename screen number. This cabinet wants 1 here.

1

# X/Y position for the backglass relative to the upper left corner of the selected screen 

# Position of Backglass start   

1440

0

# width/height of the DMD area in pixels on 3-screen cabinet (DMD gets defaults if 0,0)

1280

800

# X/Y position of the DMD area relative to the upper left corner of the backglass screen

3360

0

# Y-flip, flips the LED display upside down

0

# Backglass X/Y position when StartBackground is active, relative to upper left corner of the selected screen

0

0

# Backglass width/height when StartBackground is active

0

0

# C:\path\Frame = The path to background image or black if none selected.

Edited by Tesla, 05 November 2023 - 01:15 AM.

[wiesshund]

didnt answer question though

 

And you have put your DMD off into space, you will never see it

 

 

# This is a ScreenRes file for the B2SBackglassServer. 
# From release 1.3.1.1 comment lines like this starting with a "#" are supported. 
# If you use tools not supporting comments (or old releases), you need to remove these lines or let B2S_ScreenResIdentifier do it for you!
# Playfield Screen resolution width/height
2560
1440
# Backglass width/height
1920
1080
# Backglass Display Devicename screen number (\\.\DISPLAY)x for the Playfield or screen on position (@x) or screen index (=x)
1
# Backglass x/y position relative to the upper left corner of the screen selected
2561
0
# width/height of the B2S (or Full) DMD area
1280
800
# DMD x/y position
1921
0
# Y-flip, flips the LED display upside down
0
# Background x/y position
0
0
# Background width/height
0
0
# path to the background image (C:\path\Frame) or black if none selected
# C:\path\my_bezel_for_EM_or_grill_for_dual_screen.png
# This line would turn off B2SWindowPunch if activated
#B2SWindowPunch=off
# These lines would change the B2SWindowPunch & cutter regular expressions
#B2SWindowPunch=^different regular expression$
#cutter=^another window$

And i am assuming playfield comes up as display 1?

[Tesla]

0. 3361 technically

 

1. can you drag an object straight to the right? and land on the DMD

 

0. I guess I must explain, otherwise you are going to keep correcting me ... On my system, whenever I add those +1 pixels , un-wanted things like "images run-over to next screen by one pixel" start happening. Somehow, (for example) 1440,0 targets the backglass display properly.

 

1. I see no extra windows or graphics on either the Playfield or Backglass (they look perfect).

 

So, even Original tables have a DMD-window that must be found and drug-into place on 3rd screen? 

[Tesla]

0. didn't answer question though

 

1. And you have put your DMD off into space, you will never see it

 

2. And i am assuming playfield comes up as display 1?

 

0. Your post hadn't posted yet.

 

1. Excellent suggestion. I bet that is it.

 

So the PinMame DMD window has to be found/dragged into place ... for all 39 tables, manually? because all the coordinates changed?

 

Still doesn't explain missing DMDs on T&J and B&B, but it's a troubleshooting starting-point so, thanks.

 

2. In Windows, the LG-32 is on the far-left, in Portrait orientation, set as Primary, and Windows identifies it as Display #1.

It looks very pretty and correct.

Edited by Tesla, 05 November 2023 - 02:25 AM.

[Tesla]

OK, like before ... get the first table working completely with ALL 3 displays !

 

Tom & Jerry (2018)

 

If I Alt-Tab, I can see the DMD window (along with the others, along the bottom) but how do I "grab it" ? I'm drawing a blank.

 

Same with Beavis and Butthead. 

Edited by Tesla, 05 November 2023 - 03:48 AM.

[wiesshund]

 

 

 

0. Your post hadn't posted yet.

 

1. Excellent suggestion. I bet that is it.

 

So the PinMame DMD window has to be found/dragged into place ... for all 39 tables, manually? because all the coordinates changed?

 

Still doesn't explain missing DMDs on T&J and B&B, but it's a troubleshooting starting-point so, thanks.

 

2. In Windows, the LG-32 is on the far-left, in Portrait orientation, set as Primary, and Windows identifies it as Display #1.

It looks very pretty and correct.

 

PinMAME you should usually pick use external DLL over vpm dmd

and make sure DMDDevice.ini has stay on top = true

 

And you need to temp disable exclusive full screen to get hold of the dmd, drag it to the dmd screen, adjust it, right click it, pick save position globally

 

You run windows in portrait?

 

In that case

# This is a ScreenRes file for the B2SBackglassServer. 
# From release 1.3.1.1 comment lines like this starting with a "#" are supported. 
# If you use tools not supporting comments (or old releases), you need to remove these lines or let B2S_ScreenResIdentifier do it for you!
# Playfield Screen resolution width/height
1440
2560
# Backglass width/height
1920
1080
# Backglass Display Devicename screen number (\\.\DISPLAY)x for the Playfield or screen on position (@x) or screen index (=x)
1
# Backglass x/y position relative to the upper left corner of the screen selected
1441
0
# width/height of the B2S (or Full) DMD area
1280
800
# DMD x/y position
1921
0
# Y-flip, flips the LED display upside down
0
# Background x/y position
0
0
# Background width/height
0
0
# path to the background image (C:\path\Frame) or black if none selected
# C:\path\my_bezel_for_EM_or_grill_for_dual_screen.png
# This line would turn off B2SWindowPunch if activated
#B2SWindowPunch=off
# These lines would change the B2SWindowPunch & cutter regular expressions
#B2SWindowPunch=^different regular expression$
#cutter=^another window$

you dont grab a B2S DMD, you literally cant

it goes where screenrez tells it to and at 3300 something pixels you have it on your 5th screen, which you dont have

so you will never see it

 

If you update your b2s server to the latest, it has a drag N drop screenrez tool to use.

you might find it easier.

 

And no, not everything has a DMD

[Tesla]

 

1. PinMAME you should usually pick use external DLL over vpm dmd

 

and make sure DMDDevice.ini has stay on top = true

 

2. And you need to temp disable exclusive full screen to get hold of the dmd, drag it to the dmd screen, adjust it, right click it, pick save position globally

 

3. You run windows in portrait?

 

In that case

# This is a ScreenRes file for the B2SBackglassServer. 

4. you dont grab a B2S DMD, you literally cant

5. it goes where screenrez tells it to and at 3300 something pixels you have it on your 5th screen, which you dont have

so you will never see it

 

6. If you update your b2s server to the latest, it has a drag N drop screenrez tool to use. you might find it easier.

 

7. And no, not everything has a DMD

 

 

Good to see your post this morning, thanks.

 

1. OK, but it worked before with 3-screens. I didn't really mess with any of the other working config files.

 

2. Yes, I have Exclusive Mode OFF. I can't find DMD window (on any display) to get ahold of it. I can only see it when I "Alt-Tab".

 

Have I forgotten some of the little-config-tricks in only 6-months?   I feel like I'm back at beginner-level somehow. 

 

3. Yes, Windows and Playfield in Portrait (other 2 displays in Landscape). Yes, that ScreenRes.txt you just posted now looks more-correct. I will try yours exactly later today.

 

4. OK, that is what I thought and that is why I'm trying to use coordinates.

 

5. From, left to right, the 3 screens are:

 

1440+1920+1280

 

1440+1920=3360 

 

So, image for 3rd screen starts at 3361

 

Entry would be:

3361

0

 

6. Yeah, I remember seeing you-guys working on 2.x or whatever is latest stable-release. I guess now is the time to upgrade, it's just that this version was working fine before.

 

7. Understood.

Edited by Tesla, 05 November 2023 - 05:00 PM.

[Tesla]

 

 

In that case

# This is a ScreenRes file for the B2SBackglassServer. 
# From release 1.3.1.1 comment lines like this starting with a "#" are supported. 
# If you use tools not supporting comments (or old releases), you need to remove these lines or let B2S_ScreenResIdentifier do it for you!
# Playfield Screen resolution width/height
1440
2560
# Backglass width/height
1920
1080
# Backglass Display Devicename screen number (\\.\DISPLAY)x for the Playfield or screen on position (@x) or screen index (=x)
1
# Backglass x/y position relative to the upper left corner of the screen selected
1441
0
# width/height of the B2S (or Full) DMD area
1280
800
# DMD x/y position
1921
0
# Y-flip, flips the LED display upside down
0
# Background x/y position
0
0
# Background width/height
0
0
# path to the background image (C:\path\Frame) or black if none selected
# C:\path\my_bezel_for_EM_or_grill_for_dual_screen.png
# This line would turn off B2SWindowPunch if activated
#B2SWindowPunch=off
# These lines would change the B2SWindowPunch & cutter regular expressions
#B2SWindowPunch=^different regular expression$
#cutter=^another window$

 

I tried (exactly) this on Beavis and Butthead but I get the same thing...

 

Displays 1 and 2 look perfect. No image on DMD-Display #3.

 

I can only find DMD in Alt-Tab window-list.

[wiesshund]

make DMD X/Y position 0 and 0

 

set backglass to move to back (dight click backglass)

 

quit and restart table

 

Where is DMD? (should wind up sitting in top right corner of backglass)

 

quit table

change X position of DMD to 700

 

Start table

did DMD move to the right?

 

(make sure windows does not apply ANY scaling to any screen, all must be 100% or the numbers will be all jacked)

 

If you have a recent version of B2S Server

use the graphic utility to drag and drop the backglass and DMD positions?

Releases · vpinball/b2s-backglass (github.com)

 

​

[Tesla]

Well, I finally got something working properly.

 

I moved the LG-32 to the DisplayPort on the other end of the video-card. Then, the other two screens, one HDMI and finally another DP one.

 

Screens are again 1, 2, 3 left to right, top aligned.

 

I ran your Purge-Monitors batch-file with only the LG-32 attached at first.

 

I did have to fix the resolutions in VPX/Prefs/Video since I've been messing with displays and resolutions. 

 

I finally got Tom & Jerry (2018) working properly on 3 screens. Nothing to drag or find ... everything just properly appeared on the desired display as expected. So, now that I have a least one table working ... means alot is configured correctly now.

 

I wonder why Beavis and Butthead is not working with that same screenres.txt file. They used to use the same .res file.

Edited by Tesla, 06 November 2023 - 02:14 AM.

[wiesshund]

If Tom and Jerry works, then you have it correct

 

(keep the purge bat, you have to run it when you have fiddled or taken the pc away to do something else)

 

Make sure there is no beavis and butthead .res file existing

 

Make sure beavis and butthead actually has a DMD.

right click backglass, pick send to back, relaunch table

may sure dmd isnt behind it for some reason

also while right clicking it, make sure dmd isnt set to hidden?

 

 

[Tesla]

If Tom and Jerry works, then you have it correct

 

 

 

Yeah, we will have to remember that ...

 

Apparently, a good VPX Table for validating a basic 3-screen cabinet setup is Tom & Jerry (2018) . And that includes verifying the contents of the ScreenRes.txt file it uses.

[Tesla]

I tried that screenres.txt with a few more tables ... Looks good except for completely blank screen #3 .

 

I have still only seen one table (Tom & Jerry) work properly on all 3 screens. Even Beavis & Butthead (an Original table) ... no screen #3 (but I can see it in Alt-Tab list).

 

I'm gonna call it a night.