1103 replies to this topic

[Fusionwerks]

I suspect its the gear motor. I did actually change something from the test cab, and that was that i soldered the diode directly to the motor terminals, but they are so small, i dont know what my confidence level is that it didn't come loose or something. I will have to pull the PF monitor off and check it out. I might have to go back to soldering just the wires on then put the diode spliced in after that.

 

All my devices are powered off separate power supplies like this one for the gear and shaker, which are both 12v 

 

https://www.amazon.c...0?ie=UTF8&psc=1

[mrjoin3r]

Hi does anybody from the UK have any of the pcb's for the pinscape expansion boards they are willing to sell me. Looking to start this project but would have to order a batch from china so I thought I would ask first before having to go down that route. Thanks.

[Fusionwerks]

Hey Mike, it's been a while, but i have another question for you, and i know i've read it somewhere, but i just cant seem to find it.

 

Ive been doing the final touches on my cab and have everything working great except for the nudge...

 

I just started to try to get the nudge working and before i go through the hassle of experimenting with things that i have no idea what they mean or do, can you tell me where i should start with these settings on the different versions?

 

For reference, my KL25Z, the USB ports are on the right side.

 

what would you suggest my settings should be in this section?

 

 

I also remember reading somewhere about the differences in nudge sensitivities between versions of VP being different by a factor of 100 or something like that?, which is what i cant find.

 

I also believe i saw a YouTube video (maybe) you did that showed a test table for showing the nudge capability? Do you have a link to that test table? Or was it just a blank new table?

 

BTW, Thank you again for everything you do! You have helped me through some of the stupid things that got me stuck, and you have provided a great product that i couldn't be happier with. Not to mention the little things you thought of like Night mode, and Pinvol which make life so much nicer. Believe it or not, but my wife and I are actually starting to annoy our teenage son with the shaker and all the flashing lights at night. Hence, me getting these implemented

Edited by Fusionwerks, 17 November 2017 - 10:07 PM.

[mjr]

I just started to try to get the nudge working and before i go through the hassle of experimenting with things that i have no idea what they mean or do, can you tell me where i should start with these settings on the different versions?

 

Most of what you need should be here:  http://mjrnet.org/pi...de.php?sid=tilt

 

If there's anything missing, let me know and I'll try to add it.

 

 

I also believe i saw a YouTube video (maybe) you did that showed a test table for showing the nudge capability? Do you have a link to that test table? Or was it just a blank new table?

 

I don't have any special tables for that - you can just create a default new table and use that for testing if you want something simple to test with.  All you really need to do see the basic nudge effect is have a ball sitting in plunger chute, which you can do with any table.

[mk47]

Hi Mike,

 

I think I read the complete thread and your documention, which is fantastic BTW.

But I still have a question regarding shakers and gear motors - maybe I haven't recognized that you already answered the question anywhere.

 

I got a used 24 V DC shaker motor. What's your recommendation about attaching it to the power board?

 

From our email discussion two years ago I remember that in opposite to other solutions no H bridge is required to regulate the intensity. The MOSFET should be sufficient. But for protection and noise reduction, shouldn't we add some capacities and diodes?

[Fusionwerks]

I'm not mike, but i can probably give you the answer. No H-Bridge is necessary if you are using the power board. The MOSFETS will handle up to 10 amps if i remember right. You will need a 24v power supply, which you will hook up the positive side to the shaker motor. The negative side of the shaker goes to the power board. Your negative on the power supply also needs to be "shared" or connected to the other power supplies within your setup with the exception of the main CPU PSU.

 

And you will need a diode on the shaker motor as well. Its hooked up backwards, meaning the side of the diode that has the stripe on it (or -) goes to the 24v POSITIVE side and the other goes to the negative. Try to keep it close to the motor. I soldered mine directly on the terminals of the motor.

[mjr]

mk47, that's all good advice from Fusionwerks.  The only thing I can think of to add is that, since you asked about capacitors, the answer to that is no, you generally don't need them for a motor.  But I've heard from a couple of people that they can be worth adding to smooth things out if the motor seems rough when it runs - PWM can make some motors run rough because it switches the power on and off rapidly.  I don't think there's a fixed size cap to recommend, but I'd start with something like 1000uf and see what the effect is.  With a capacitor, you want to install it across the motor terminals just like the diode, except that a polarized capacitor should be installed in forward polarity ("+" on the cap to "+" voltage, "-" on the cap to ground). 

[mk47]

Thanks for your feedback. I'll start experimenting and report the results.

[yagesz]

HELP!!!!!

So I got a pinscape ready to go. And I am flipping lost on the wiring.....

The board flashes Red and yellow meaning no Pot calibrations. Great don't care about that. I am just trying to get the Knocker working so I know its right.

I bought a 12v and a 24v PSU to drive all my bits. Motors, Contactors, Knockers. 

 

 

How do I wire this just for the knocer to work. I have 24PSU >> Knocker >> Pinscape. One piece of wire between each.

The pinscape has a 12v and ground as well as a 5v and ground going into the board on the label 2nd PSU.... Do i need power going to the 1 PSU as well? What am I overlooking? And will I have to wire the chime, expansion, and reg board all the same?

 

 

 

Does the board it self just act as a ground? How do I drive my 24v parts from it? All of the main guide/visualization online makes it look like I am suppose to join all my grounds together?

 

I would love a  more precise wiriing diagram. Everything I find is just everywhere.

Edited by yagesz, 30 November 2017 - 11:45 PM.

[mjr]

The pinscape has a 12v and ground as well as a 5v and ground going into the board on the label 2nd PSU.... Do i need power going to the 1 PSU as well? What am I overlooking? And will I have to wire the chime, expansion, and reg board all the same?

 

Yes - you'll need to connect BOTH of the power supply inputs.  

 

The "PC PSU" input needs to be connected to +5V and GND from your primary power supply, the same one that powers the PC motherboard.

 

The "2ND PSU" input needs to be connected to +12V, +5V, and GND from your secondary power supply, the one that you use for feedback devices.  It's fine to use the same power supply for both inputs, but a separate power supply is recommended for devices so that (a) you don't create excessive load on your main PC supply, and (b) you don't inject as much electrical noise into the PC motherboard as you would if everything were running off of the same supply.

 

And yes, you need to connect both supply inputs the same way on all of the Pinscape boards.  The "PC PSU" connectors to all boards can be connected together in a daisy chain, and you can do the same with the "2ND PSU" inputs.

 

 

All of the main guide/visualization online makes it look like I am suppose to join all my grounds together?

 

That's right.  You actually only have to connect all of the feedback device power supplies together.  The main PC power supply ground is already connected to the secondary PSU ground because of the way ATX power supplies are wired internally.  They're all connected together through your "Earth Ground" wire in the power plug.  

 

 

 

How do I wire this just for the knocer to work. I have 24PSU >> Knocker >> Pinscape. One piece of wire between each.

 

 

The basic wiring plan for all feedback devices is like this:

 

+30V  -----------   Replay Knocker Coil ------------- Pinscape knocker output port

 

With a coil, remember that you have to attach a diode across the coil's terminals.  It's crucial for suppressing voltage spikes from the coil.  See here:  http://mjrnet.org/pi...02xx&sid=diodes

 

 

Most other output devices have the same basic plan.  LEDs are a little different because they need current-limiting resistors, and because they're polarized:

 

+5V -------- (+)LED(-) ------- RESISTOR -------- Pinscape output port

 

 

 

I would love a  more precise wiriing diagram. Everything I find is just everywhere.

 

Sorry I haven't gotten there yet with the new build guide!  It's been taking a woefully long time to complete.

 

Hopefully this'll get you going.  Let me know how it goes.

[yagesz]

So I have it going. Firing a 12v solenoid of the knocker port.

I only have the 5v in and ground from combined psu hooked up and it drives the board. Why do I need all 3 setups? 12v5v secondary 12v mainpsu?

[mjr]

So I have it going. Firing a 12v solenoid of the knocker port.

I only have the 5v in and ground from combined psu hooked up and it drives the board. Why do I need all 3 setups? 12v5v secondary 12v mainpsu?

 

The two power supply inputs are required because the boards are designed to allow the logic side to be fully isolated (electrically) from the high-power side (the feedback devices), to prevent electrical noise from the devices from reaching the logic circuitry and your PC motherboard.  In practice, if there's an ATX power supply on the device side, it's not truly isolated because of the way the grounds are internally connected (all ATX supplies work this way because it's a requirement of the spec).  Even so, separating the grounds on the boards like this should at least minimize the noise reaching the logic sections.

 

The boards have a bunch of logic and switching circuits that all need power.  Some of that is in the logic section and some is in the power section.  For example, the MOSFETs that control the high-power outputs are driven by the +12V input from PSU2, so nothing with a MOSFET stage will work if you don't connect it.  All of the PWM chips (the TLC5940s) work off of the PC PSU 5V input.  If you want all of the pieces to work, you have to give them power, so you have to connect all of the power inputs.

[yagesz]

I actually understood all of that. But now your telling me I should be using a pc psu instead of my 12v psu. What a pain.


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[mjr]

I actually understood all of that. But now your telling me I should be using a pc psu instead of my 12v psu. What a pain.

 

The separate 12V PSU should be fine, actually, as long as the grounds are connected. Really, the PC PSU is supposed to be the opposite of "a pain" - PC PSUs are really easy and cheap ways of getting nice, solid, high-current 5V and 12V rails.  If you want to use a different type of PSU for those voltages, that's okay too.

[yagesz]

My issue now is I need 3.3v for LEDs. 5v for your board. And 12v. I hate planning so much.


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[gtxjoe]

A PC Power supply has all those voltages available

[mjr]

My issue now is I need 3.3v for LEDs. 5v for your board. And 12v. I hate planning so much.

 

You can use 5V for the LEDs.  I'm guessing you want 3.3V because their spec sheet says "Forward Voltage = 3.3V".  For an LED, that's actually just the minimum supply voltage.  What you need to do is go to an LED calculator like this one:

 

http://led.linear1.org/1led.wiz

 

...and plug in the Forward Voltage from the LED's specs, the Forward Current from the LED's specs, and 5V for the power supply.  That will tell you the size of the resistor you need.  Be sure to pay attention to both the OHMS rating and the WATTS rating.  Some high-power LEDs require unusually high wattage resistors.

[yagesz]

I actually have a zebs lightbar with a resistor board


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[mjr]

I actually have a zebs lightbar with a resistor board

 

Ah.  Well, in that case, the resistors have already been chosen for you, so you'll want to go with the voltage he specified.

 

You can find "step down DC-to-DC voltage regulator" on eBay for cheap that should do the trick.  They'll take 5V in and let you dial in a selected voltage on the output.  Or you can probably even find one that's fixed at 3.3V, since it's a very common voltage for logic chips and CPUs.  Just make sure you get one that's rated for enough current for the flashers - you'll want at least 5A.

[yagesz]

Last question. Can the primary and secondary 5v come from the same 2nd power supply.


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