458 replies to this topic

[Gravy]

Hi Gravy

 

 

I have 3 3D Cabinets:

 

Do you have an LG 3D TV? What size and model?

 

3D 42" TV LG  - 42LM6200

3D 42" TV LG  - 42LM6400

3D 47" TV LG  - 47LM4600 - A little bit big but is good. I think that higher than 47 there would not be like real pinball.

 

.......

 

 

Thanks for the info, that's quite a collection of 3D screens you have. I understand what you are saying about the 3D appearing to move around when you move your head position from central to either left or right.

 

However my question was actually about whether your sweet spot for 3D is actually when your head is positioned at the lower centre of your screen? For me on my 32" LG 32LW4500 (2011 model), the sweet spot is to the left of centre which is a bit annoying as I need to move my body about 4-6inches to the left of where it feels natural to stand. If I stand centrally the 3D image ghosts more. This is why I feel it would be great to be able to have a setting to adjust this issue. I assume this is not an issue for your screens?

Edited by Gravy, 14 May 2024 - 12:10 AM.

[Emanoel299]

 

Hi Gravy

 

 

I have 3 3D Cabinets:

 

Do you have an LG 3D TV? What size and model?

 

3D 42" TV LG  - 42LM6200

3D 42" TV LG  - 42LM6400

3D 47" TV LG  - 47LM4600 - A little bit big but is good. I think that higher than 47 there would not be like real pinball.

 

.......

 

 

Thanks for the info, that's quite a collection of 3D screens you have. I understand what you are saying about the 3D appearing to move around when you move your head position from central to either left or right.

 

However my question was actually about whether your sweet spot for 3D is actually when your head is positioned at the lower centre of your screen? For me on my 32" LG 32LW4500 (2011 model), the sweet spot is to the left of centre which is a bit annoying as I need to move my body about 4-6inches to the left of where it feels natural to stand. If I stand centrally the 3D image ghosts more. This is why I feel it would be great to be able to have a setting to adjust this issue. I assume this is not an issue for your screens?

 

Hi Gravy

 

I know you mean. I´m positioned at the center. I have a bit ghost in the center table lights and some bright white flippers.

I can reduce this divergence (ghost) reducing the depth as follow:

 

Play it with VPX 10.7 DX9  with Reshade DX9 version 5.9 ( the newest some parameters doesn´t exist) - I made a lot of POV settings and four ReshadePreset.INI file for different tables.

(VPX 10.80 DX9 no way).

Reshade is the best way to reduce the divergence (ghosting). It´s need to adjust by Notepad because on GUI there is ZPD limits.

 

Example:

 

For EM and LED tables

 

ReshadePreset – RA0.ini:

Divergence=10.000000

ZPD_Separation=0.035000,0.500000

 

ReshadePreset – RA3.ini:

Divergence=10.000000

WZPD_and_WND=0.030000,0.030000,0.000000,0.250000

ZPD_Separation=0.035000,0.500000 

 

For DMD, FlexDMD and UltraDMD tables

 

ReshadePreset – RB0.ini:

Divergence=17.000000

ZPD_Separation=0.040000,0.450000

 

Reshadepreset – RB3.ini:

Divergence=17.000000

WZPD_and_WND=0.030000,0.030000,0.000000,0.250000

ZPD_Separation=0.040000,0.450000

 

I know that is hard. I needed to create four different emulator folders, frontend scripts to call the correct ReshadePreset.ini file in the correct playlist table.

 

The RA3 and RB3 files is due to the fact that tables normally fit well with the RA0 and RB0 standard, however some were above the screen glass (floating in space) so I had to create a variation called RA3 and RB3 to correct them.

I´ve used import the Mandalorian POV values to adjust the others tables.

 

So, it´s reason that I changed to VPX 10.80 - 1862 GL InBuilt 3D stereo.

But there are issues too.

Although is very and pratical to adjust the .INI view file there are some divergences.

The VPX 10.80 - 1862 GL inbuilt 3D version is too much brighter compared to VPX 10.7 DX9 with Reshade DX9

So, you can see more ghosting if compare to Reshade, but is much better 3D view.

To reduce the ghosting you will need to reduce the brightness where is possible, as lightning table, VPX video settings or TV brightness adjust.

Also Interlaced method is brighter than SBS or TOP/bottom method but I think is better to use frontend.

 

At last I reduced the ghosting for most tables but not eliminated.

Edited by Emanoel299, 15 May 2024 - 12:14 AM.

[humunut]

I finally broke down and installed RC4 "VPinballX_GL-10.8.0-1975-051104c-Release-win-x86".

I tried the real 3D stereo option with Red/Cyan glasses and the calibrated Luminance filter, running the "Lord of the Rings (Stern 2003) VPW 1.5" table.

 

I was very impressed by the 3D effect. So much so that I don't want to go back to 2D even tho the color reproduction is poor.

 

I am wondering if I should try green/magenta Trioviz glasses. I have read that they have better color reproduction and brightness, but less 3D depth and more ghosting. Does anyone have experience using the green/magenta Trioviz glasses with VPX8 GL real 3D, and be willing to share?

[dan_shane]

I am wondering if I should try green/magenta Trioviz glasses. I have read that they have better color reproduction and brightness, but less 3D depth and more ghosting. Does anyone have experience using the green/magenta Trioviz glasses with VPX8 GL real 3D, and be willing to share?

 

I own and have tried every version of anaglyph 3D glasses with VPX, including ColorCode and TrioViz. The NeurotrackerX red/cyan glasses still surpass all other methods as far as depth without ghosting, but it does desaturate the color on most tables.  I play almost exclusively in 3D now -- playing tables "flat" just doesn't cut it anymore.

[Emanoel299]

 

I am wondering if I should try green/magenta Trioviz glasses. I have read that they have better color reproduction and brightness, but less 3D depth and more ghosting. Does anyone have experience using the green/magenta Trioviz glasses with VPX8 GL real 3D, and be willing to share?

 

I own and have tried every version of anaglyph 3D glasses with VPX, including ColorCode and TrioViz. The NeurotrackerX red/cyan glasses still surpass all other methods as far as depth without ghosting, but it does desaturate the color on most tables.  I play almost exclusively in 3D now -- playing tables "flat" just doesn't cut it anymore.

 

Yes, cool

 

If you can say that is no more 2D to play I understand what you mean.

I know that nowadays 3D TV is no longer on sale but I have some of them.

And I can say. "I can´t play 2D anymore".

Although you loose vertical resolution but, you have all colors.

2D only in 4K TV if some friends are by my side to watch a game but it is weird for me.

Edited by Emanoel299, 07 August 2024 - 01:25 AM.

[Junkyerd2]

Buying a neurotrackerx pair of glasses..40 euros..

 

I think my 3d experience with cellophane paper green-magenta has no enemies...

 

Really need a trioviz or neurotracker glasses for a decent 3d experience? really?

 

Where it`s the charging port for the neurotrackerx glasses?    

[humunut]

@dan_shane

Have you tried the green/magenta Trioviz glasses with VPX8 GL real 3D?

My regular Red/Cyan glasses work very well in terms of depth and ghosting, so I doubt any other Red/Cyan glasses can do much better.

 

Just noticed this: https://github.com/v...ball/issues/846

Lots of good info there. Looks like green/magenta Trioviz is not the answer. Need proper anaglyph green/magenta glasses.

Edited by humunut, 07 August 2024 - 04:03 PM.

[humunut]

Could not find green and magenta film for testing locally, so ordered this:

 

https://www.rainbows...40209092542511#

 

Will report back on how well they work for me...

[humunut]

The green/magenta (GM) glasses I ordered arrived. Unfortunately, it appears that VPX8 GL real 3D does not currently work correctly for GM glasses. When I tried the GM glasses on LOTR, I could see 3 images of each table item. (Maybe this means the stereo images are too far apart?)

 

I also tried calibrating the GM glasses in the Live Table Editor. Could see the green and magenta colored indicators of what type of glasses I had set to use, but the written description did not match. Pretty sure it said "cyan red" (but maybe it was "red cyan", can't remember for sure). And the stereo image of the LOTR table that was produced after that was appropriate for cyan/red glasses, even tho I had specified GM in the 3D settings.

 

So I can't say yet if the GM glasses are an improvement over the RC glasses for LOTR. I think I saw more color with the GM glasses, but seeing 3 images of everything made it too difficult to reach any definite conclusions. That will have to wait for some fixes to the relevant part of the VPX8 code.

[qcol]

I own and have tried every version of anaglyph 3D glasses with VPX, including ColorCode and TrioViz. The NeurotrackerX red/cyan glasses still surpass all other methods as far as depth without ghosting, but it does desaturate the color on most tables.  I play almost exclusively in 3D now -- playing tables "flat" just doesn't cut it anymore.

 

I have the same thing. I have the usual cheap red/cyan but ever since I saw the effect, how the ramps look, how clearly you can see their levels - I can't go back to 2D

The only problem is with the backglass and reading the score (although I have seen versions of some backglasses in 3D). 

For the time being, I drop the glasses on the booger of my nose and I can see the playfield in 3D and the backglass in 2D    

[jcopps]

Apologies if this has been addressed somewhere in the thread; I tried to look a bit but I couldn't find anything.  Is there a way to improve convergence (or focus?) of the image in Reshade (or in the table settings) at both the front and back of the table simultaneously without sacrificing the depth of the image?  Frequently I will try to set things so that the middle of the table is at maximum focus with the ZPD balance in Reshade, but this leaves the front and back of the image quite blurry.  Of course adjusting focus to the front or back also leaves the opposite end extremely out of focus.  Was just wondering if there's any good solution to this.

 

Also, is VPX GL better for Anaglyph 3D?  Again, apologies if this has been answered.

Edited by jcopps, 08 November 2024 - 12:30 AM.

[mistermixer]

Also tested some glasses like red/blue, trioviz ... but the only way to go is VR imo.  This is the only solution at this moment to experience playing pinball like it should be.  Zero latency, full depth and colours , exact table measurements...  So if you allready have a computer that can run 4k then adding a quest3 should be on your to do list.  You won't regret it  

[Emanoel299]

Also tested some glasses like red/blue, trioviz ... but the only way to go is VR imo.  This is the only solution at this moment to experience playing pinball like it should be.  Zero latency, full depth and colours , exact table measurements...  So if you allready have a computer that can run 4k then adding a quest3 should be on your to do list.  You won't regret it  

I agree. It's not good to regress but, unfortunately, 3D mode still requires the use of glasses in any format. This is the problem because people who have never used any type of glasses in their activities do not like to use them for other purposes.

This is one of the reasons why 3D mode in general is not convincing, in addition to being a personal and not shared experience. Too Many people oppose the use of a 50 g glasses but do not complain about a 300 g VR glasses.

I'm happy to have my 3D TV and use it in my cabinets as a playfield. OK it loses resolution but I have all the colors and excellent depth and practicality.

Of course, VR is the best option but it's tiring for me if played for a long time due to the weight of the glasses on my face.

In 2D just play in 4K to share with friends in real time.

Unfortunately, if it is not VR, nowadays only the anaglyph. It´s too hard to find a good used 3D TV for sale.

Edited by Emanoel299, 08 November 2024 - 01:41 PM.

[BostonBuckeye]

Also tested some glasses like red/blue, trioviz ... but the only way to go is VR imo.  This is the only solution at this moment to experience playing pinball like it should be.  Zero latency, full depth and colours , exact table measurements...  So if you allready have a computer that can run 4k then adding a quest3 should be on your to do list.  You won't regret it  

Hi mistermixer,

I was looking into buying a quest 3 which claims it is 4k but I understand it isn’t close to the resolution of a 4k monitor. Is this true? I can’t stand looking at anything that isn’t crystal clear. Also, I wear glasses. Would I have to purchase the Zenni prescription lenses to use it or is it possible to wear my glasses? My prescription is really high. Also, isn’t the quest 3 primarily a stand alone set? How well does it work with PC games like VPX? I appreciate any guidance you might give me.

[mistermixer]

Don't own a 4k monitor.  My cab is + 10 years old so 37 inch 1080p tv ( with latency ) but all toys,buttons still work great.  Recently changed to a new pc with 4080 super graphics card and the quest 3 .  Could change the screen with a 40 inch 4k but i'm gonna pass on this because playing in VR is amazing.  ( most of the time i play virtual pinball on my own )   So have all the benefits of the solenoids,buttons, toys and soundsystem from the cabinet combined with the quest 3 with link cable and the vrlauncher browser software.  And can also still play like before ( 2d or with trioviz glasses, reshade and pinup popper )   

 

I would advice you to test the quest3 in a local store ( i'm not wearing glasses ) or order one and if not satisfied return it with refund.  

 

'Spacies Arcade' has  excellent vid's on youtube about VR and cabinet play !  Find this one very interesting          It's about the screensize in a cab and the point of view compared with a real pin.   ( and what NOT to do is sizing a table , vertical or horizontal ... i did this on all the tables, so i play(ed) them the wrong way.  

Edited by mistermixer, 09 November 2024 - 01:23 PM.

[BostonBuckeye]

Don't own a 4k monitor.  My cab is + 10 years old so 37 inch 1080p tv ( with latency ) but all toys,buttons still work great.  Recently changed to a new pc with 4080 super graphics card and the quest 3 .  Could change the screen with a 40 inch 4k but i'm gonna pass on this because playing in VR is amazing.  ( most of the time i play virtual pinball on my own )   So have all the benefits of the solenoids,buttons, toys and soundsystem from the cabinet combined with the quest 3 with link cable and the vrlauncher browser software.  And can also still play like before ( 2d or with trioviz glasses, reshade and pinup popper )   

 

I would advice you to test the quest3 in a local store ( i'm not wearing glasses ) or order one and if not satisfied return it with refund.  

 

'Spacies Arcade' has  excellent vid's on youtube about VR and cabinet play !  Find this one very interesting          It's about the screensize in a cab and the point of view compared with a real pin.   ( and what NOT to do is sizing a table , vertical or horizontal ... i did this on all the tables, so i play(ed) them the wrong way.  

Thanks for the advice. I will watch this video. I watched the “Spacies Arcade” video on what screen size is needed for a 1 to 1 representation of a real pinball table and 48” is as close as you can get. The LG 48 “ C4 OLED 4k TV looks amazing. I am trying decide between this and the quest 3. I don’t have a cab. I just have a two monitor set up on monitor arms, but I position them the same as if they were in a cabinet. Eventually I may build a cabinet. But not if I buy the quest instead. I really wish they still sold 3-D TVs.

 

Okay this is the same video I watched.

Edited by BostonBuckeye, 10 November 2024 - 01:45 AM.

[BostonBuckeye]

@ mistermixer   I think I am going to take the plunge and get the Meta Quest 3. My CPU is an i9-13900K and my GPU is an RTX 4070 Ti. Hopefully this is enough power to run VPX smoothly on the Quest 3. I plan to purchase Meta Quest's link cable for $80 and not use the wireless connection. Hopefully this will help as well as the processing power that the Quest 3 comes with to have super clear, near 2k/4k graphics like it seems you are getting. If there is any blurriness at all I will return the Quest. 

 

Are there any recent tutorials you recommend for setting up the quest and VPX in VR? The ones I have located are about a year old.

[arcade warrior]

Have been using this method with Trioviz glasses for over a year now and simply cannot play without it. Amazing real table feel. Super cheap option as well. Highly recommend if you dont want to outlay $ for VR

[BostonBuckeye]

Have been using this method with Trioviz glasses for over a year now and simply cannot play without it. Amazing real table feel. Super cheap option as well. Highly recommend if you dont want to outlay $ for VR

Thanks. I just ordered a pair to try out. I am going to hold off on buying a VR set for a while. I want to see what comes out in the next year. What are your Anaglyph 3-D settings in VPX for these glasses?