666 replies to this topic

[fuzzel]

Please try rev 878. I reworked the z scaling feature because the old way was totally wrong With that revision the z scaling will have an impact on the physics too because you stretch everything the collision must be stretched too. My quick tests showed no problems on ramps or higher walls anymore. Keep in mind that if you change existing tables the scaling can create problems on ramps/walls. Especially if you have some connections between two ramps or you throw the ball with a kicker on a ramp.

[fuzzel]

And another update: rev 879 adds the z offset option to the backdrop options. With this you can zoom in/out a table without changing the FOV/Inclination/Layback settings. The Z offset is in the same dimension as the X/Y offsets (negative values zoom into the table).

[jimmyfingers]

@fuzzel - That's great getting the Z offset now as an option as well and opens up some opportunity for further view tweaking with or without even using the Z scale. On the Z scale aspect, now that it's affecting collisions and physics it's changing tables and things like ramp shots become harder or not even possible at all. Also, without the ball Z scale changing in proportion to the table physics, it is slipping under some solid objects once they're raised / stretched enough.

 

I think there's a bit of a dilemma where if the physics change to make up for the visual aspects previously witnessed, then all sorts of tables would have to be reworked and rechecked for all those little bugs / stuck balls / corridors that they'll get into but shouldn't. That may make the feature end up not being very useable or desirable by authors. Of course, the less the Z scale factor is increased the less impact on the table but it still affects the table physics if used at all and will open up uncertainty and potential unreliability in the game play. However, I'm really thinking your initial approach to not have it affect any physics may still be the right approach. As long as the ball physics are not changing / don't / can’t change, it's going to be a problem for the table physics to change leaving the ball as is / was.

 

It seemed it was very close on the previous revision to being workable with view only changing and the only thing was the graphical issue with ball height. As I was saying in my previous post, can you not manipulate the ball drawing code to take the current ball.Z where it would be drawing the ball image and then just draw it instead at ball.z*Zscale? I don't know in the code if this could be done but I think it would be much better than any alteration on physics of any objects. Having some graphical anomalies and working with them vs. the physics changing and what will end up happening to the tables that anyone tries to use it on seems like the better option of the two.  Or maybe conversely, having the ball Z scale actually change along with the table but having the visual not impacted (probably would not help getting up the ramps though but would help the falling under the raised walls aspect).

 

Toxie was saying in a previous post that the ball image is only 2D when dealing with the lighting options so I’m still hoping that this aspect may yield options for manipulating the image draw point or the Z scale of the ball without affecting the image of the ball (but the latter I would say would be much more preferred).

 

Thanks for these last couple changes and would be great if we could get it in a fully workable fashion without affecting the physics of tables as the Z-scale is definitely adding and improving the view at least on the new single / hybrid view tables. 

[fuzzel]

hmm that makes sense...I tried it (multiply the factor with the z coordinate) but then the ball is stretched...

[jimmyfingers]

That seems strange that the ball would be stretched just from changing the height at which the image is drawn (if not changing the actual Z size of the ball) or are you referring to altering the actual Z size / value of the ball?  Also, there's some magic that cupid did for dealing with the ball drawing regarding the anti-stretch / stretch with table / do not stretch with table options that manipulates the image of the ball that he devised after initial layback views were "squishing" the ball vertically.  Maybe something can be gleened from what he did with those global video options that might help deal with this dilema?  It might be interseting to see what those 3 different video settings yield when changed around and testing things.

Edited by jimmyfingers, 17 January 2014 - 10:31 PM.

[rascal]

Is there anyway VP could do like a keystone perspective? I don't know if that is the proper word, but here is a drawing to show what I mean.

In my opinion the back wall and the playfield should have like a keystone affect, and maybe this is accomplished by having a different camera view, I don't know.

Edited by rascal, 18 January 2014 - 01:54 AM.

[Mitchell]

Is there a script to where you can make the ball not to scretch? Without checking the box.

[toxie]

Is there anyway VP could do like a keystone perspective? I don't know if that is the proper word, but here is a drawing to show what I mean.

In my opinion the back wall and the playfield should have like a keystone affect, and maybe this is accomplished by having a different camera view, I don't know.

 

I already experimented a lot with raves code that he uses in BAM to get something similar, but didn't finish that yet.. :/

[skinooe]

THANKS FOR ALL YOU HAVE DONE

[ringorian]

Sound deactivation / remapping

Would it be possible to add checkboxes in the soundmanager to easy disable sounds we dont need ?
second it would be great to have a way in the sound manager to import your own favorite sounds in an own "reposotory" and map them to the original sounds.
Like when i have my personal slingshot sound i like which is called sling and the one used in the table is slingshotleft it could be done by a dropdown to say play sling when slingshotleft should.
So no renaming and deleting of the original is needed ...
Would be great.

[pinballrockstar]

ok, so i too have installed the VP920/VP92X version. i must say its really smooth working/looking and playing.

really like the update. also updated some of the tables for VP920. it's working just fine. thank you.

[Pin-Pete]

There seems to be a small bug with the ball.Every time I shoot it to upper playfield or to ramp it seems to have tail like comet.

[Xendo]

There seems to be a small bug with the ball.Every time I shoot it to upper playfield or to ramp it seems to have tail like comet.

 

That's not a bug.  It's a feature of 9.2 called Ball Trails/Motion Blur.  If you do not want ball trails on then you can turn them off via Preferences > Video Options.

[fuzzel]

Please test rev 880. Now the z-scaling won't have an impact on the physics anymore and I hope I fixed the drawing issue when the ball rolls over a ramp or higher wall.

[ICPjuggla]

I know I've said it before, but I wanted to thank you guys again for all your doing..... We (as in the community) all appreciate your hard work and dedication in advancing VP and its features.... :-)

Edited by ICPjuggla, 19 January 2014 - 07:59 PM.

[jimmyfingers]

Please test rev 880. Now the z-scaling won't have an impact on the physics anymore and I hope I fixed the drawing issue when the ball rolls over a ramp or higher wall.

Thanks man, looking forward to checking it out!

 

EDIT:

 

Tried it out and the ramp issue with the ball drawing lower than it when using Z scale above 1, is still occurring.  See screen capture below (I enabled ball shadows temporarily to demonstrate the issue better):

 

 Capture of Z scale ramp (ball height) graphic issue (rev 880).PNG   262.7KB   17 downloads

 

I'm attaching a test table as well so you can easily reproduce the problem.  Too bad, I'm still really hoping we can get this resolved as some of the tables with this setting tweaked look really nice and it fixes some other tables that were arguably designed without enough height for some of the modern - very tall / deep - tables.

 

Still, thanks as other's mention for all you guys are doing and for still pressing away on this particular issue / request.

Attached Files

•  Z Scale Test Table.vpt   128KB   3 downloads

Edited by jimmyfingers, 19 January 2014 - 09:23 PM.

[fuzzel]

thanks Jimmy. I'll try it out tomorrow.

I know I've said it before, but I wanted to thank you guys again for all your doing..... We (as in the community) all appreciate your hard work and dedication in advancing VP and its features.... :-)

Thanks, you're welcome! This is really a nice hobby and without of all those great tables you and all the other great authors out there do I hadn't the motivation spending my time on this So actually I have to thank YOU for creating some of my fav. tables

[fuzzel]

Please test rev 881. There was a bug that didn't apply the scaling if the ball reflection wasn't enabled.

[gtxjoe]

Has there been any discussion on supporting grouping of objects.  i.e select a post made up multiple walls and ramps.  Right click and select 'Group'.  Now if you click on the post, it acts as 1 item.  Move it, copy it, scale it etc.  If you need to modify an individual elements, ungroup and then modify.  Maybe the point selection would have to be disabled when items are grouped.

 

In a sense, its combining multiple object selection with the behavior of the collection manager.   It would allow us to easily select posts, bumpers, rubbers, screws and move/copy them without accidentally modifying the objects

[rascal]

The progress you guys are doing with VP is outstanding, I love the new features. There are so many new features I can't keep up.

 

Please don't take my suggestions as anything more than just suggestions. I'm just trying to plant a seed that may not have been planted before.

 

If you could implement BAM similar features in VP, I would fall out of my chair.