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Flash Gordon (Bally, 1980) call for resources


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#1 sza

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Posted 01 June 2010 - 12:57 PM

I'm starting on FP recreation of Flash Gordon. With customs models enabled it should be possible now.

Please let me know if you are in possession of a hi resolution pictures of play-field or plastics, or the real machine itself, or even the flayer that could be
scanned with 600 or more dpi.
The idea is to make it look perfect. IMO playing 80s pinball recreation is 80% nostalgia + 20% playing fun, so making great looking FG for FP make sense even if there is a very nice nice FG for VP but limited by VP graphical engine.

If there is anybody interested in participating in any other way let me know as well.








#2 faralos

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Posted 01 June 2010 - 05:14 PM

you mean this one? did ya' try IPDB? that is where I got these

Attached Files


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And most important, have the courage to follow your heart and intuition.”
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#3 sza

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Posted 01 June 2010 - 07:49 PM

Yes, I downloaded anything I could find on "usual suspects": IPDB, classicplayfields, pinballowners, ebay and flayers. websites. The biggest image from is 1500X800px and looks great, but it is still too small to vectorize/trace it. These web shots are all scaled down to the screen resolution.
Any closeup pictures taken from angle close to 90 deg in camera resolution (6 or 9 mp) pictures would do, even if they are bit ugly.

Thanks. anyway.

#4 rdeejay

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Posted 02 June 2010 - 03:44 AM

Ask Scapino nicely he might help you out, i'm pretty sure he did a redraw of the playfield when he did his version.

#5 sza

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Posted 02 June 2010 - 03:27 PM

QUOTE (rdeejay @ Jun 2 2010, 04:44 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Ask Scapino nicely he might help you out, i'm pretty sure he did a redraw of the playfield when he did his version.

Thanks, Good idea. Wish me good luck!


#6 faralos

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Posted 02 June 2010 - 07:56 PM

"Good luck!!" there that outta' do it Come tonto our job here is done "Hi Ho Silver away!" (galloping off on my stick horse into the sunset, clip-clop, clip-clop)
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#7 Deedolith

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Posted 04 June 2010 - 07:30 PM

You may want to gently ask ClassicPlayfield for a good picture of the playfield.
That's what I did for my Swords of Fury plastics pictures (I even offered them to pay), they answered there was no need to pay, and there was a very nice PDF containning the plastic pictures attached with their answer.
I then installed a plug in into GIMP to convert the PDF into a workable graphic format.

Edited by Deedolith, 04 June 2010 - 07:31 PM.


#8 sza

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Posted 06 June 2010 - 01:44 AM

Thanks for the hint, I'll do it.
Meanwhile I got few nice images from Scapino, especially apron and slingshots plastics are great.
The hardest part to find in a decent quality are the top arc plastics.


QUOTE (Deedolith @ Jun 4 2010, 07:30 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
You may want to gently ask ClassicPlayfield for a good picture of the playfield.
That's what I did for my Swords of Fury plastics pictures (I even offered them to pay), they answered there was no need to pay, and there was a very nice PDF containning the plastic pictures attached with their answer.
I then installed a plug in into GIMP to convert the PDF into a workable graphic format.



#9 sza

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Posted 11 June 2010 - 01:13 AM

CPR still did not release their FG reprints, so they will not give anything until they are done with sales (Quite, understandable).
Anyway the "unfinished" playfield they put on their website is more than good enough.
Scapino agreed to share his super nice images of most plastics. Big thanks! Only thing that I still miss completely are good images of top arc plastics.

Modeling bent plastics joining upper and bottom playfields takes a lot of time since they cant be adjusted directly in in FP, so it takes about 20 reloads before they are right size, shape and angle, but at least FPM editor from LvR works perfectly. It makes FP twice as good as it was.

Here a small preview of the "construction site"


#10 PLATINUM

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Posted 11 June 2010 - 01:19 AM

Looking good dude, keep up the good work - love the updates, keep em comin.

#11 sza

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Posted 20 August 2010 - 07:13 PM

Here is a little update. Table is 95% done, Sounds 60% ready, and the basic scripting 70% ready.

If anybody has or can take a hi res picture of the upper arc plastics or the access to a real machine, please help out!



Edited by sza, 20 August 2010 - 07:13 PM.


#12 PLATINUM

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Posted 20 August 2010 - 08:48 PM

LOOKING AWESOME, !!!!!!!!! Good work , looks a very high standard.

#13 rob046

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Posted 21 August 2010 - 08:58 PM

QUOTE (sza @ Aug 20 2010, 03:13 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Here is a little update. Table is 95% done, Sounds 60% ready, and the basic scripting 70% ready.

If anybody has or can take a hi res picture of the upper arc plastics or the access to a real machine, please help out!




It looks like you have what you need according to your last screenshot. Are you not happy with the plastic you have? Is that the issue?

I probably do have some nice high rez pics of the game, & as for whether or not they will help you, maybe clarify exactly what you need. Or maybe post the texture you are working with now so that I can tell you if what I have might be better or not.

I just played this game over the weekend, don't think I took new pics, but might have, but I've taken pics of it before, I'm sure of it.
So if there are any resources you need from this table that you arent happy with that you think some of my high rez pics might take care of just let me know. & I do take pics with VP in mind, I grab a nice player perspective shot usually, then an overhead shot (or as overhead as I can get), then I may take a few pics (perspective & overhead) of top & bottom halves of the table. Again I'm not sure if I have a ton for Flash Gordon, but I'm sure I have a couple at least. Also, if you want I'd be glad to playtest the table for you.
Not only did I play this over the weekend, but I was playing a bunch of these double level games, so they are fresh in my mind. I also played some BK, Jungle Lord, Pharoah, Elektra, Solar Ride (or is it Solar City). Flash Gordon must be one of the first Bally double level pins, cuz most of them (or all of them) before it were Williams pins.

#14 sza

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Posted 22 August 2010 - 01:05 AM

Great! Thanks!
I'd love to have any of your photos depicting the two plastics on the very top of the playfield, just underneath the back box, on both sides of the top popbumper. One of them shows Flash Gordon with a ray rifle, and the other a hooded skull. I have something, but it is not good enough in comparison to the rest. So overhead shots of the top half of the playfield would be the best.

Thanks for the offer of playtesting, as soon as I'll have scripting done I can send it over to you, but it can take a while, since busy time at my job is approaching again. Anyway, IMO these simulations can't stand up to the real thing. So certainly it will be nothing like playing real FG. Lucky you, to play these great games. I love early solid state pins. Last time I saw Flash Gordon in flesh it was around 1987, I think sad.gif.

BTW. how did you find Electra? Is it nice to play or boring? I considered getting one,but I never played the real thing. I like under play field feature, but pinball without pop bumpers...

"Solar Ride (or is it Solar City)" solar fire .. maybe?

QUOTE (rob046 @ Aug 21 2010, 09:58 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
It looks like you have what you need according to your last screenshot. Are you not happy with the plastic you have? Is that the issue?

I probably do have some nice high rez pics of the game, & as for whether or not they will help you, maybe clarify exactly what you need. Or maybe post the texture you are working with now so that I can tell you if what I have might be better or not.

I just played this game over the weekend, don't think I took new pics, but might have, but I've taken pics of it before, I'm sure of it.
So if there are any resources you need from this table that you arent happy with that you think some of my high rez pics might take care of just let me know. & I do take pics with VP in mind, I grab a nice player perspective shot usually, then an overhead shot (or as overhead as I can get), then I may take a few pics (perspective & overhead) of top & bottom halves of the table. Again I'm not sure if I have a ton for Flash Gordon, but I'm sure I have a couple at least. Also, if you want I'd be glad to playtest the table for you.
Not only did I play this over the weekend, but I was playing a bunch of these double level games, so they are fresh in my mind. I also played some BK, Jungle Lord, Pharoah, Elektra, Solar Ride (or is it Solar City). Flash Gordon must be one of the first Bally double level pins, cuz most of them (or all of them) before it were Williams pins.

Edited by sza, 22 August 2010 - 01:12 AM.


#15 rob046

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Posted 22 August 2010 - 07:15 PM

QUOTE (sza @ Aug 21 2010, 09:05 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Great! Thanks!
I'd love to have any of your photos depicting the two plastics on the very top of the playfield, just underneath the back box, on both sides of the top popbumper. One of them shows Flash Gordon with a ray rifle, and the other a hooded skull. I have something, but it is not good enough in comparison to the rest. So overhead shots of the top half of the playfield would be the best.

Thanks for the offer of playtesting, as soon as I'll have scripting done I can send it over to you, but it can take a while, since busy time at my job is approaching again. Anyway, IMO these simulations can't stand up to the real thing. So certainly it will be nothing like playing real FG. Lucky you, to play these great games. I love early solid state pins. Last time I saw Flash Gordon in flesh it was around 1987, I think sad.gif.

BTW. how did you find Electra? Is it nice to play or boring? I considered getting one,but I never played the real thing. I like under play field feature, but pinball without pop bumpers...

"Solar Ride (or is it Solar City)" solar fire .. maybe?


I'll see what I can find then, I'll let you know if its anything decent. Wow, 1987 you last saw this, you need to get to a convention to something! I really like all these double level games & had a blast playing them. I may even like Pharoah over BK & JL. Oh, & I just checked, its Solar Fire. There are a lot of "solar" pins!
Anyhow, solar file tons of fun, that might even be my #2 fav double level. Not saying BK isn't good, but maybe I'm just so familiar with it & its so popular that its refreshing to me to give some of these other games a solid run. Or maybe my preferences what they are. Besides, all these games are kinda similar, I wish any one of them would pop up for sale around me. I passed on a BK last year, but instead I got an EBD, & I don't regret that one bit. But I'm all for making another run at a nice double level game, even a triple level HH or Elektra!

Elektra, I think people have differing opinions on this one. Me personally, IDK, in some ways its good. I like at least a few drop targets on a game, but Elektra is more a bunch of standup targets. Not sure why. Yeah there are a couple drops behind the captive ball, but you can't even directly hit them. Still cool though. I like captive balls & drops, so a neat little feature. Other than that though, it standup city! Standups make a game a little harder to control, the ball wants to spaz out. where with drop targets you can sometimes get into a nice rythym cuz the drops dampen the ball a bit.
Anyhow, no denying how cool that lower PF is though. Considering I never had a double level pin, it would be very cool to have a pin that can be played on 3 different levels/heights. I wish Krull had made it into production. That would have made for another nice triple level option. I think I personally would like the game in real life, though not everybody seems to be a fan.
Haunted House easily remains better than Elektra, I really want one. But if I saw an Elektra for a good deal I would consider snagging one, it would just be a cool pin to have & show off.

You mention pinball without bumpers. I don't mind it one bit. Clearly I don't cuz I own a DMD era pin that doesn't have bumpers, JD. If the design calls for it, I'm fine with it, no bumpers can really helps keep a nice pace to the game. The pins I was just talking about. Pharoah, Jungle Lord, Solar Fire, no bumpers on any of those either, & it works fine. When you want to pack a game with lots of shots, 4 flippers, & 2 levels, I think bumpers just get in the way. Even BK only has 1 lone ass bumper that seems kinda thrown in there cuz it was convenient, which is fine. But its not a big part of the game I don't think.
Big Guns is another no bumper game that I personally kinda like. So yeah, no bumpers truly doesn't bother me, so long as the lack of them is replaced by other fun worthwhile shots & layout design.

#16 sza

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Posted 24 August 2010 - 09:40 PM

Thanks for that. I'll wait patiently for the outcome of your search.

I like to play DMD era games on a location, but very few I'd like to keep at home. The story is usually fun, but it takes a few games to beat and than there is not much reason to play it again. Early SS games are my favorites, they are just about the score, so you can play them almost forever (much like the asteroid video game).

That is funny, I never noticed that these two level pins did not have bumpers, it must be OK indeed, but on Elektra it is somehow noticeable.

FG is fairly common game, but I had no luck. I played Pharoah & Solar Fire lately. The upper deck on Pharoah seemed just too easy. Solar Fire was more fun, but it fried on me sad.gif. My personal no. 1 is Black Hole, super fast, great rules, always a challenge and ... bit creepy, plus 90% of the time on the end of the game I had the "one more try" urge that filled its coin boxes back in the days, but HH stands also very high on my wish list. EBD is a great game too, in general I find pool billiard themed games to be good on average. The theme just lend itself nice for a challenging and intuitive rules for a pinball machine. In contrast, FG has somehow unappealing rules, I'm considering adding an option to chose between original and alternative rules set.


QUOTE (rob046 @ Aug 22 2010, 08:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I'll see what I can find then, I'll let you know if its anything decent. Wow, 1987 you last saw this, you need to get to a convention to something! I really like all these double level games & had a blast playing them. I may even like Pharoah over BK & JL. Oh, & I just checked, its Solar Fire. There are a lot of "solar" pins!
Anyhow, solar file tons of fun, that might even be my #2 fav double level. Not saying BK isn't good, but maybe I'm just so familiar with it & its so popular that its refreshing to me to give some of these other games a solid run. Or maybe my preferences what they are. Besides, all these games are kinda similar, I wish any one of them would pop up for sale around me. I passed on a BK last year, but instead I got an EBD, & I don't regret that one bit. But I'm all for making another run at a nice double level game, even a triple level HH or Elektra!

Elektra, I think people have differing opinions on this one. Me personally, IDK, in some ways its good. I like at least a few drop targets on a game, but Elektra is more a bunch of standup targets. Not sure why. Yeah there are a couple drops behind the captive ball, but you can't even directly hit them. Still cool though. I like captive balls & drops, so a neat little feature. Other than that though, it standup city! Standups make a game a little harder to control, the ball wants to spaz out. where with drop targets you can sometimes get into a nice rythym cuz the drops dampen the ball a bit.
Anyhow, no denying how cool that lower PF is though. Considering I never had a double level pin, it would be very cool to have a pin that can be played on 3 different levels/heights. I wish Krull had made it into production. That would have made for another nice triple level option. I think I personally would like the game in real life, though not everybody seems to be a fan.
Haunted House easily remains better than Elektra, I really want one. But if I saw an Elektra for a good deal I would consider snagging one, it would just be a cool pin to have & show off.

You mention pinball without bumpers. I don't mind it one bit. Clearly I don't cuz I own a DMD era pin that doesn't have bumpers, JD. If the design calls for it, I'm fine with it, no bumpers can really helps keep a nice pace to the game. The pins I was just talking about. Pharoah, Jungle Lord, Solar Fire, no bumpers on any of those either, & it works fine. When you want to pack a game with lots of shots, 4 flippers, & 2 levels, I think bumpers just get in the way. Even BK only has 1 lone ass bumper that seems kinda thrown in there cuz it was convenient, which is fine. But its not a big part of the game I don't think.
Big Guns is another no bumper game that I personally kinda like. So yeah, no bumpers truly doesn't bother me, so long as the lack of them is replaced by other fun worthwhile shots & layout design.



#17 Rawd

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Posted 24 August 2010 - 09:42 PM

I must have missed this thread. The table looks great man, excellent work!

rawd3.gif

 


#18 moogster66

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Posted 24 August 2010 - 09:56 PM

(Doing my best Freddie Mercury) FLASH! AAAAAaaaaa! cool.gif
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#19 pizz

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Posted 25 August 2010 - 06:21 PM

Yes cant wait for this! Please try and update the sound. It would be great to hear clips from the movie! SLAMT1LT does a great job with the audio on his tables.

BTW I'm working on retouching some low res playfields including FG. I have quite a few converted into hi res already so feel free to ask smile.gif

Edited by pizz, 25 August 2010 - 06:23 PM.


#20 rob046

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Posted 25 August 2010 - 08:27 PM

QUOTE (sza @ Aug 24 2010, 05:40 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Thanks for that. I'll wait patiently for the outcome of your search.

I like to play DMD era games on a location, but very few I'd like to keep at home. The story is usually fun, but it takes a few games to beat and than there is not much reason to play it again. Early SS games are my favorites, they are just about the score, so you can play them almost forever (much like the asteroid video game).

That is funny, I never noticed that these two level pins did not have bumpers, it must be OK indeed, but on Elektra it is somehow noticeable.

FG is fairly common game, but I had no luck. I played Pharoah & Solar Fire lately. The upper deck on Pharoah seemed just too easy. Solar Fire was more fun, but it fried on me sad.gif. My personal no. 1 is Black Hole, super fast, great rules, always a challenge and ... bit creepy, plus 90% of the time on the end of the game I had the "one more try" urge that filled its coin boxes back in the days, but HH stands also very high on my wish list. EBD is a great game too, in general I find pool billiard themed games to be good on average. The theme just lend itself nice for a challenging and intuitive rules for a pinball machine. In contrast, FG has somehow unappealing rules, I'm considering adding an option to chose between original and alternative rules set.


Good news & bad news. Bad news, I just went through a bunch of pics from the past 4 years I went to PAPA, talking thousands of pics. & not one time did I take pics of Flash Gordon! I thought I would have snapped it at least one year, but no. But there is a reason why I think I didn't. Flash Gordon has always, to me, seemed to have decent resources available. I think of Scapino's table, plus the fact that this is a pretty popular table, & assume that resources should be pretty easy to find. For example, I don't take pics of TAF, cuz there are resources out there better than what I'll get with my camera.

Good news, I found a batch of pics not taken by me, they are very high rez & there are closeups of the upper area & plastics, taken by some dude that used to take real nice closeup pics of pins he was selling & I always snagged them. However, this particular machine is dirty, & part of the upper left plastic is cracked in the far upper corner. Basically, the dude in the upper left plastic, his little head is cracked off!
Other than that, the rest of the art is there, but as I said its a bit dirty. You should be able to photoshop them clean though, & I think you can manage photoshopping the tiny dude's head back on there. I also threw in a 300dpi scan of the FG flyer (with the overhead PF). I cut out the top area, did a few simple photoshop tricks to fix it up a tad...sharpen, saturation, made the blacks darker. In fact, considering these plastics sit at the far back of the table, even this flyer scan could work in FP as a decent texture if you wanna fix it up a bit more in photoshop. You don't even need to crop or angle correct.

Nice thing about this flyer shot is that it does NOT have that bar that lays overtop of the back of the pin that obscures part of the plastics (like you'll see on the pics of the pin or pics of any pin from this era). That damn bar! So between the pics, & using the flyer image to use as reference (the dude's head & "Flash Gordon" text that is normally obscured), I think you can photoshop yourself some real nice upper plastics.
Might I recommend just adding that stabilizing bar to the recreation, so that you don't have to recreate the text on the far upper plastic that says "Flash Gordon". Hey its blocked in real life, might as well be blocked on the recreation! In fact, it may not look right if it isn't blocked. Do this, then your main focus is just to get that dude's head filled in. Clean em up, & you should be good to go!

I just wish I had taken the pics of the FG that I just played cuz it was a pretty nice example. I guess I wish I would of known somebody needed any resources for this table, I didn't know.
Also, I knew there was good PF resources out there for this pin.
& to be honest, I think you could track down scans of this area & other plastics, but getting them is tough.
I have somebody that helps me out with scans for my real pins, he has a huge collection of scans & stuff that used to be onlilne but now due to copyright issues can't be found anymore. However, I only wanna bug this guy if I'm really in a pinch or somebody really has no other option than to find a scan for some reason when building a table, but if I bug him every time I wanna help somebody out with a scan or two for VP he will probaby get sick of me. In this case, between what I have here in this zip & a little photoshop, this should be fine. You also might be able to find even better actual pics as far as reference for filling that guys head in. The flyer is OK, but maybe you can find better. Again, with a plastic at the way far back corner of the table, I don't think you need to be too perfect with this.

Here you go...(only a few pics, but like I said they are very high rez, hence the 15mb+ size)...
https://rcpt.yousend...994ae3119999434