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3d visual pinball or 3d future pinball - possible?


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#61 toxie

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Posted 25 July 2012 - 07:59 AM

QUOTE (sleepy @ Jul 25 2012, 07:50 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Which 3D engine does it use? Is it the Direct3D 11.1 Stereo API or other?
Is it a custom engine?
Can the VP/rendering be split to two CPU cores?

The Direct3D 11.1 stereo app has something M$ calls "Render Direct2D content on the stereo 3-D swap chain.", using the back buffer, though I suspect that would only be the backdrop?


it's custom, as VP is still DX7.. the best we can do for now without having giantic restructuring of the core..


QUOTE (CaptainNeo @ Jul 25 2012, 07:58 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I wouldn't want to wear the glasses tho. Think i'll wait till I can get a 42" monitor that doesn't need glasses. But for cab, your looking at it from an extreme side angle, usually for 3D that results in most of the 3D effect to be flattened and minimized. It's awesome in theory, and would rock of the pops and everything would seem to over over the monitor, but right now the technology isn't there on the monitors sides of things. not for cab users anyway.


the problem is that glasses-free monitors are not built for rotated usage (as it would make them even much more expensive, if even technically possible without sacrificing quality for 'normal' TV usage)..

QUOTE (sleepy @ Jul 25 2012, 08:11 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Are your glasses linear polarized 3d glasses, hence the need to rotate the polar films?

I wonder if the circular polarized glasses 3D monitors work in either horizontal or vertical monitor alignment since the polarization in this version is circular clockwise for one eye and circular counterclockwise for the other? I wouldn't think rotating the monitor with the circular polar system would fail the 3D view.


there is no problem, as basically its just the same as if you would just rotate the glasses the same way as you rotate your TV.. the thing is just that the glasses then don't fit on your head anymore.. wink.gif so that's why one has to rip them apart..
but as you say, circular polarization works without that, but AFAIK the TVs are much more expensive..

Edited by toxie, 25 July 2012 - 08:02 AM.


#62 sleepy

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Posted 25 July 2012 - 09:53 PM

All good toxie. smile.gif

#63 toxie

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Posted 30 July 2012 - 09:08 AM

FYI: i started yesterday with the UI exposure of the new parameters, so hopefully i'll get it all finished by the end of the week.. some tables are also crashing mid-game (have a feeling though why that is), which needs some more debugging work, too..

#64 toxie

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Posted 10 August 2012 - 11:58 AM

another update: work continues, UI is done, most crashes resolved.. there are still crashes for -some- tables, f.e. sometimes when a piece of the table is partially off-screen, but this can be easily solved by not doing that.. wink.gif
hopefully i'll figure that out over the weekend and then it's ready to be tested by others.. smile.gif

#65 am1001

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Posted 14 August 2012 - 08:27 PM


great Toxie! We are very grateful for your work on this smile.gif



#66 am1001

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Posted 30 August 2012 - 10:06 PM


do you need beta testers - I'd love to help. When will it be available to try? Stereoscopic visual pinball will be fantastic!

#67 toxie

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Posted 31 August 2012 - 11:53 AM

beta testers: actually no, it all works and should be fine..
release: now comes the bad part: the crash i mentioned above is STILL there, and to be honest, it drives me insane by now! and i'm running out of ideas.. sad.gif but if the table is reasonably set up (nothing overlapping the screen borders) then it all works perfectly..

#68 unclewilly

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Posted 31 August 2012 - 12:05 PM

When you say overlapping the screen, do you mean say and alpha flasher stretches over the edge of the physical screen window or stuff is overlaping on the table?

If its stuff overlappine the edge of the screen i would think a simple change in the scale would resolve the issue

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#69 toxie

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Posted 31 August 2012 - 12:34 PM

exactly, the screen window.. but the "funny" thing is that it is not always the case, so depending on table, resolution and the computer its run on.. sad.gif
(i could simply say it's a driver issue, but i guess that's not the case here wink.gif)

#70 Practicedummy

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Posted 31 August 2012 - 01:29 PM

As long as Bethesda isn't the ones you go to for crash help, you will be fine. biggrin.gif

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#71 Slydog43

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 11:54 PM

Any new news on this exciting topic?

#72 sleepy

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Posted 14 September 2012 - 10:11 AM

Is the crash a memory leak, or maybe an error in the blit causing a double error? Not sure what to call it, but when the left eye is rendered and the program then attempts to render the right eye, the program might be getting the blit confused thinking that it is already done for that frame.

Else, offscreen texture error for running out of assigned system RAM memory space or when the left and right images are written to the drive as offscreen texture overflow above the assigned system RAM for image data greater than the card's capacity?

How is the collision detection being handled?
Are you using the left eye frame or the right eye frame, or are both views entering the collision detection function?

Does the crash occur during Play?
Maybe using both views for collision detection are behaving as if the functions exist twice in the code.

Edited by sleepy, 14 September 2012 - 10:20 AM.


#73 toxie

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Posted 14 September 2012 - 11:41 AM

update: the crash i mentioned is resolved (man, this was an extremely stupid one which could have been resolved within minutes if i wouldn't have assumed some much more complicated sideeffects :(), now the only thing that still worries me is some weird crash that destruk found on his setup (at fullHD 1920x1080 resolution only), but i'm tempted to say that this is only a driver/hardware combination problem.. ;)

then i also optimized some more (again, this was related to my own stupidness) and most tables are now playable at more or less fixed 50-60fps @ 1920x1080 on my cab (i.e. good enough to not get noticable lag), except for some with A LOT of alpha and animated objects/lamps/GI, like TOTAN night.. (here i get ~30fps, strange enough my intel-gfx laptop still has ~100 though ;))

apart from that, now all tables i tested so far (i.e. quite some/around 120) work out of the box, some better, some worse (depending on how old they are and how much 2.5D trickery they use (i.e. T2 chrome sucks for example) and so on), but tables like indiana jones, medieval madness, attack from mars, roadshow, no fear, scared stiff (and more that i don't remember) do look extremely awesome as-is..

although i can highly recommend to use the laidback approach that was mentioned in another thread (i.e. increase inclination/fov) to give the table elements more depth (which requires that the TV is build in aligned with the playfield glass though and not flat/"aligned to earth"), as it then looks like the table is really situated within the pinball cabinet itself..
i myself cannot go back to 2D gameplay anymore, because the realism is simply soooo much better now.. :)

#74 sleepy

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Posted 17 September 2012 - 11:32 PM

3D. It's Solid. :)

#75 jimmyfingers

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Posted 18 September 2012 - 12:06 AM

Where can I get a copy of the latest code to check-out / test? Is it available in any form yet with your latest fixes and tested tables? Would love to give it a spin man ;)

#76 Slydog43

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Posted 21 September 2012 - 06:00 PM

I played Zen 3D Pinball on a PS3 with a Sony 3D monitor and it was totally AWESOME! If this is anything remotely like that, I would pay money for such a thing. Can't wait to try this out or at least see a video of this (not sure that would work). Please tease us more with more details. Thanks for all your hard work.

#77 sleepy

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Posted 25 September 2012 - 07:21 AM

Not to interfere, but youtube now offers 3d stereo video uploads, so if there is an available demo of this project....

#78 toxie

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Posted 25 September 2012 - 10:19 AM

hopefully we can release it soon, but currently i have to take care of family stuff, but i hope next week i can fix the final bug we're seeing on some setups (it simply doesn't run at all anymore on these :/)
and then everybody can try for him/herself soon.. all i can say is that i was pleasantly surprised myself.. :)

#79 toxie

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 10:04 AM

update: having a bit of time on my hands right now, and the first issue that destruk reported (see my post from sept14th) should now be fixed..

now on to the final(?) crashing issue..

#80 rockme

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 03:37 PM

Can´t wait!! Thanks for your great work! :love39: