Jump to content




Photo
- - - - -

Mockup for a next-generation VP database

vpdb database

  • Please log in to reply
135 replies to this topic

#1 freezy

freezy

    Member title

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 366 posts

  • Flag: ---------

  • Favorite Pinball: T2, TOM, AFM

Posted 09 April 2014 - 09:40 PM

Hello folks,
 
Now that Mukuste opened up his magic box again, I assume that VP10 development will go full throttle. And since it will come most likely with a new table format, I thought that it might be time for a new download platform as well. I had a few ideas and actually wanted to present a PDF containing a mockup how it would look like, but then there were animations involved and you can't really show those in a PDF, can you.
 
Anyway, what you'll see is still only a mockup, all data is hard-coded, so is all the media and the download buttons don't do anything. The only table that has data in the details view is Monster Bash (and some in AFM as well). All you edit/delete is reset next time you refresh the browser, so knock yourself out. ;)
 
Check it out here: https://vpdb.io/
 
Please also read through the GitHub page, there are a few explanations about why and how I did this.
 
What I would need from you guys are comments about the data structure, which is still completely open. You can have a look at it here. Also if you can think about additional features, I would be glad to add them into the mockup. There's of course still a lot missing, like the admin and upload pages and all the "social" features where you would get streams with info about data tables/authors you're following.
 
I'm aware that posting this on a forum where people pay to download stuff might be a delicate operation, but as you can see, this is completely open-source. So Noah, if you're willing to integrate this somehow into VPF, I'm more than willing to help. Right now it runs on a free Heroku account.
 
Oh, and by the way I didn't test IE at all, so please take another browser. On your phone however it should render okayish. :)
 
Cheers,
 
   -freezy.
 
 
EDIT: It's not a mockup anymore. :)

Edited by freezy, 26 November 2016 - 10:08 PM.


#2 unclewilly

unclewilly

    sofa king.....

  • VIP
  • 4,716 posts
  • Location:Baltimore, Maryland

  • Flag: United States of America

  • Favorite Pinball: tz, tom, big hurt, who dunnit



Posted 09 April 2014 - 09:50 PM

Looks good on my phone.

The only thing I might suggest,
Maybe a home page that would allow skipping by letter as there are a lot of tables and scrolling through may be tedious.

I like the format though

"it will all be ok in the end, if it's not ok, it's not the end"
 
Monster Bash VP10 WIP https://dl.dropboxus... (vpx)WIP15.vpx

uw2.gif


#3 freezy

freezy

    Member title

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 366 posts

  • Flag: ---------

  • Favorite Pinball: T2, TOM, AFM

Posted 09 April 2014 - 10:05 PM

Well, there is a search function that returns results instantly, so the letter-browsing approach is kind of obsolete, right?



#4 Shadowsclassic

Shadowsclassic

    Pinball Fan

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1,446 posts
  • Location:Depauw, Indiana

  • Flag: United States of America

  • Favorite Pinball: Elvira and the Party Monsters

Posted 09 April 2014 - 10:36 PM

I like the format too,  makes me feel a little like Lt. Worf. A little LCARS looking for us Trek fans.

 

The letters are obsolete  unless you are doing fills. I sometimes go through a letter  at a time to make sure I haven't missed anything that's been released or updated. 

 

Speaking of updates, that's really my only complaint with this site.  It's sometimes hard to tell when someone releases an update as it does not appear in new downloads and it's either late getting posted in forums or I miss because there are so many posts to go through at times. 

Make a way to flag new releases and updated material easily and I'll be happy as a clam. :)



#5 gigalula

gigalula

    Hummmm not sure yet :)

  • Platinum Supporter
  • 650 posts

  • Flag: Canada

  • Favorite Pinball: All of them from 70' to now. Even more with VP and FP :)

Posted 10 April 2014 - 12:59 AM

Looking good

I think that any release should come default with RELEASE DATE+VP VERSION+TABLE VERSION for an easiest way to search any thing by title,date, ect ect.... A more power full search to ensure any new update is not missing and of corse a flag "NEW" if the file is newer then last visit ;)


Edited by gigalula, 10 April 2014 - 01:00 AM.


#6 ReDEy3

ReDEy3

    Enthusiast

  • Silver Supporter
  • 75 posts

  • Flag: United States of America

  • Favorite Pinball: Addams Family

Posted 10 April 2014 - 01:16 AM

Hello, I am still very new to the whole Visual Pinball but have already fell in love with it.  I spend almost all of my spare time (I don't have much) downloading and trying to get everything to work.  I still don't fully understand all of the nuances, but I would really like to see if there was a better way to download things than what the current VP download method offers.  I may be completely too new still but in order to get a table fully working with Visual Pinball/Hyperpin a whole bunch of different files (Rom, table, B2S, video, wheel art, etc.) need to be downloaded.  It would be awesome if they could package more of these things into a single download so that we don't have to spend so much time downloading.

 

I guess it just takes a lot of time to get quite a few tables up and running and once that's done I'll stop my whining ;)

 

Also, if someone is developing VP10...please make it 64-bit compatible out of the box.


Edited by ReDEy3, 10 April 2014 - 01:24 AM.


#7 vampirolatino2

vampirolatino2

    Pinball Fan

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1,430 posts

  • Flag: Spain

  • Favorite Pinball: Medieval Madness

Posted 10 April 2014 - 01:30 AM

loving it



#8 mukuste

mukuste

    Pinball Fan

  • VP Dev Team
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 854 posts

  • Flag: ---------

  • Favorite Pinball: Centaur

Posted 10 April 2014 - 01:49 AM

Whoah, it's so slick!

 

The biggest hassle for me has always been

  1. finding the latest version of a table through the clunky forum interface, which it seems your UI already takes care of; maybe different releases of the same real-world table could be grouped under the same heading somehow?
  2. downloading the table, unzipping it, moving it to its proper directory, then hunting for the ROM, likewise moving it where it needs to go. I guess cab users have an even worse time with this. I don't know if the ROM file can be included for legal reasons, but even if it can, it seems there would need to be different packages for desktop users, cab users, then you have different backglass versions... What if, and I'm only dreaming here, there would be a simple client-side application which gets a special download link from your site and then does all this stuff automatically? You'd have to set it up once with the proper paths, and then it takes care to unzip the table, makes sure you have the ROM and downloads it otherwise, gets any B2S file it is told to... Not that easy to do obviously, but that would be the most convenient thing ever.


#9 teppotee

teppotee

    Enthusiast

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 382 posts
  • Location:Finland

  • Flag: Finland

  • Favorite Pinball: CV

Posted 10 April 2014 - 01:49 AM

Looking really good! I hope this goes forward!

 

One question:

If user selects AFM for example -> will this view show all releases of this table? Or only the original versions and then you would get the MODs for that table under the mod section of that release?

 

Because I think this is the way it should work and also looks like from UI point of view. However the AFM example you have used is a MOD already so I'm not sure how the table/mod relation is planned now.

 

I think this kind of parent - child relation between a released table and MOD's based on that would be really good. This would eliminate the confusion about the author(s) of the original release and always show that one first (as it should... because without it there would be no MOD :)).



#10 arngrim

arngrim

    DJ Force Feedback

  • VIP
  • 2,129 posts
  • Location:Charleroi, Belgium

  • Flag: Belgium

  • Favorite Pinball: Monster bash



Posted 10 April 2014 - 05:56 AM

Also there are so many backglasses available on other forums, will you integrate them?

#11 freezy

freezy

    Member title

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 366 posts

  • Flag: ---------

  • Favorite Pinball: T2, TOM, AFM

Posted 10 April 2014 - 06:34 AM

 

Whoah, it's so slick!

 

The biggest hassle for me has always been

  1. finding the latest version of a table through the clunky forum interface, which it seems your UI already takes care of; maybe different releases of the same real-world table could be grouped under the same heading somehow?
  2. downloading the table, unzipping it, moving it to its proper directory, then hunting for the ROM, likewise moving it where it needs to go. I guess cab users have an even worse time with this. I don't know if the ROM file can be included for legal reasons, but even if it can, it seems there would need to be different packages for desktop users, cab users, then you have different backglass versions... What if, and I'm only dreaming here, there would be a simple client-side application which gets a special download link from your site and then does all this stuff automatically? You'd have to set it up once with the proper paths, and then it takes care to unzip the table, makes sure you have the ROM and downloads it otherwise, gets any B2S file it is told to... Not that easy to do obviously, but that would be the most convenient thing ever.

 

1. If you look at the GitHub page there's more detailed info about it, but in a nutshell it's exactly as you describe: All table releases are linked to the real-world table, you wouldn't actually be able to upload a table release without finding  (or creating) its parent.

2. I feel your pain. The good news is that I've created exactly that about a year ago, it's called Pind and basically indexes VPF, offers a nice UI and allows downloading and unzipping everything to the right place in one click. I'm using it on my cab and it works, but installation is kind of cumbersome on Windows (Node.js needs a few native modules that need compiling), that's why I've never officially announced it here (only over at Hyperspin-fe).

 

Looking good

I think that any release should come default with RELEASE DATE+VP VERSION+TABLE VERSION for an easiest way to search any thing by title,date, ect ect.... A more power full search to ensure any new update is not missing and of corse a flag "NEW" if the file is newer then last visit ;)

All but VP version is already there, and that's actually a good point. Adding to TODO.

 

 

Looking really good! I hope this goes forward!

 

One question:

If user selects AFM for example -> will this view show all releases of this table? Or only the original versions and then you would get the MODs for that table under the mod section of that release?

 

Because I think this is the way it should work and also looks like from UI point of view. However the AFM example you have used is a MOD already so I'm not sure how the table/mod relation is planned now.

 

I think this kind of parent - child relation between a released table and MOD's based on that would be really good. This would eliminate the confusion about the author(s) of the original release and always show that one first (as it should... because without it there would be no MOD :)).

Yes, for now it would list one release after another, latest first. However, now I think about it, it would be indeed nice to somehow "attach" the mod to its parent. Putting all into the accordion tab probably won't do it, but I'll figure something out!

 

Also there are so many backglasses available on other forums, will you integrate them?

By "integrate" you mean if they're going to be available once there's actual data? Not sure, I would think that authors would upload their creations themselves, so you'd need to ask them ;)

 

 

I'm going to spend some time on a homepage / dashboard in order to show you what kind of information we could pull out of a structured data set.



#12 arngrim

arngrim

    DJ Force Feedback

  • VIP
  • 2,129 posts
  • Location:Charleroi, Belgium

  • Flag: Belgium

  • Favorite Pinball: Monster bash



Posted 10 April 2014 - 06:44 AM

Ah ok i thought that it is you that add tables, backglass and so on

#13 freezy

freezy

    Member title

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 366 posts

  • Flag: ---------

  • Favorite Pinball: T2, TOM, AFM

Posted 10 April 2014 - 07:10 AM

Ah ok i thought that it is you that add tables, backglass and so on

 

Well if this is going to see the light of the day, then it's not without the community. Maybe I forgot to mention this, but the goal of this thread is also to see if the community (and specially the table authors) are willing to embrace a new platform. If that's the case, I will with pleasure invest more time and work on a prototype. However I don't think I would be able to maintain it all by myself if no one else is interested.



#14 arngrim

arngrim

    DJ Force Feedback

  • VIP
  • 2,129 posts
  • Location:Charleroi, Belgium

  • Flag: Belgium

  • Favorite Pinball: Monster bash



Posted 10 April 2014 - 08:03 AM

I agree that one person that adds is a big task, but if anybody can add, there need a governance above to control what is presented

#15 freezy

freezy

    Member title

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 366 posts

  • Flag: ---------

  • Favorite Pinball: T2, TOM, AFM

Posted 10 April 2014 - 08:07 AM

Sure, I was thinking about an intermediate "QA" status where stuff goes live only after approval from "non-trusted" users.



#16 BlackPredator72

BlackPredator72

    I ❤ Pinball

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 329 posts
  • Location:Haarlem, The Netherlands

  • Flag: Netherlands

  • Favorite Pinball: Demolition Man

  • PS3 Gamer Tag: BlackPredator72
  • 360 Gamer Tag: BlackPredator72

Posted 10 April 2014 - 08:42 AM


Speaking of updates, that's really my only complaint with this site.  It's sometimes hard to tell when someone releases an update as it does not appear in new downloads and it's either late getting posted in forums or I miss because there are so many posts to go through at times. 

Make a way to flag new releases and updated material easily and I'll be happy as a clam. :)

 

Looks good, nice clear layout and I like it very much you have all needed files on 1 page instead of searching on 6 different categories and sometimes multiple forums...

If you don't wanna miss anything with updated tables or other art or rom files. maybe the updated ones can be on the first page (recent files at the beginning) like this FP site : http://www.pinsimdb.org/

Or something like :

 

VPDB.png


My Predator Cab : Click here


#17 freezy

freezy

    Member title

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 366 posts

  • Flag: ---------

  • Favorite Pinball: T2, TOM, AFM

Posted 10 April 2014 - 08:56 AM

Yep, the goal is to produce something similar to pinsimdb, only more "modern" and fully VP compatible. The "new/updated" label will play an important role of course, so I'm gonna add this to the next iteration on some random tables.



#18 mukuste

mukuste

    Pinball Fan

  • VP Dev Team
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 854 posts

  • Flag: ---------

  • Favorite Pinball: Centaur

Posted 10 April 2014 - 09:23 AM

 

 

Whoah, it's so slick!

 

The biggest hassle for me has always been

  1. finding the latest version of a table through the clunky forum interface, which it seems your UI already takes care of; maybe different releases of the same real-world table could be grouped under the same heading somehow?
  2. downloading the table, unzipping it, moving it to its proper directory, then hunting for the ROM, likewise moving it where it needs to go. I guess cab users have an even worse time with this. I don't know if the ROM file can be included for legal reasons, but even if it can, it seems there would need to be different packages for desktop users, cab users, then you have different backglass versions... What if, and I'm only dreaming here, there would be a simple client-side application which gets a special download link from your site and then does all this stuff automatically? You'd have to set it up once with the proper paths, and then it takes care to unzip the table, makes sure you have the ROM and downloads it otherwise, gets any B2S file it is told to... Not that easy to do obviously, but that would be the most convenient thing ever.

 

1. If you look at the GitHub page there's more detailed info about it, but in a nutshell it's exactly as you describe: All table releases are linked to the real-world table, you wouldn't actually be able to upload a table release without finding  (or creating) its parent.

2. I feel your pain. The good news is that I've created exactly that about a year ago, it's called Pind and basically indexes VPF, offers a nice UI and allows downloading and unzipping everything to the right place in one click. I'm using it on my cab and it works, but installation is kind of cumbersome on Windows (Node.js needs a few native modules that need compiling), that's why I've never officially announced it here (only over at Hyperspin-fe).

 

 

Ah, that's sweet. I've actually stumbled over Pind before, but I didn't fully understand at the time what it actually does, and it only seemed to be interesting for cab users, so I didn't look into it too much. Do you plan to make this database integrate with Pind in any way?



#19 freezy

freezy

    Member title

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 366 posts

  • Flag: ---------

  • Favorite Pinball: T2, TOM, AFM

Posted 10 April 2014 - 09:28 AM

Well this should already solve 90% of the annoyances Pind was actually made for. But yes, if there's interest that would be possible without huge efforts. I was however more thinking about PinballX/Hyperpin integration. As in PinballX automatically adding/updating tables and artwork using the REST API. Maybe even a plugin where you can link your browser to the cab resulting in a "Install on cab" button that does the necessary - similar to CouchPotato for those who know it.



#20 Syco54645

Syco54645

    Enthusiast

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 195 posts
  • Location:Pittsburgh, Pa

  • Flag: ---------

  • Favorite Pinball: kewpie doll, theatre of magic

Posted 10 April 2014 - 01:04 PM

Glad people are doing my idea that everyone said was silly...  If this can have an api to download the tables and check the version you have even better. I even started making it but stopped when I was told it was stupid...







Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: vpdb, database